Planning Policy Commission · Thursday, June 2, 2022 · City Council Digest

3. REGULAR BUSINESS

Adopt Rules & Regulations

Action · 60 min · Stephen Padua, Long Range Planning Manager The Planning Policy Commission meeting Rules and Regulations are available for your · packet pp.41–67

Open packet at p.41 ↗

Staff report:

The purpose of the June 2, 2022 Planning Policy Commission (PPC) special meeting is to provide the Commission with required training and to update the Rules and Regulations.

4. REPORTS

Council Update

Stephen Padua, Long Range Planning Manager

5. OTHER BUSINESS / ANNOUNCEMENTS

Upcoming Schedule

packet pp.69–71

▶ Watch from 1:39:07 Open packet at p.69 ↗

Staff report:

Planning Policy Commission 2022 Schedule (subject to change) 2022 1/20/22 1/27/22 Joint Meeting with Development Commission ▪ Public Hearing: Proposed 2022 Docket of Education: Title 18 - Building and Design Comprehensive Plan and Zoning Map ▪ Neighborhood Overlay Standards Amendments January o Olde Town, Central Issaquah, Issaquah Joint Meeting with Development Commission Highlands, Talus Title 18: Education - Building and Design ▪ Neighborhood Overlay Standards o Olde Town, Central Issaquah, Issaquah Highlands, Talus 2/10/22 2/24/22 Joint Meeting with Development Commission Joint Meeting with Environmental Board

2563 segments .txt ↗

0:04 ↗ good evening planning policy commission

0:06 ↗ uh tonight i'd like to call the june 2nd

0:09 ↗ planning policy commission special

0:10 ↗ meeting to order and it currently is 6

0:13 ↗ 30 p.m

0:15 ↗ due to the virtual format of today's

0:16 ↗ meeting i'd like to start by providing

0:18 ↗ some guidelines all of you have heard

0:20 ↗ once or twice

0:21 ↗ uh we're gonna have participants

0:23 ↗ attending by computer and others who may

0:25 ↗ be attending by phone for all meeting

0:27 ↗ attendees who wish to speak please speak

0:30 ↗ clearly and pause

0:31 ↗ frequently

0:34 ↗ see what i did there

0:36 ↗ state your name each time before

0:38 ↗ speaking

0:39 ↗ mute your microphone when you're not

0:40 ↗ speaking and if you're having any

0:42 ↗ technical issues try joining the meeting

0:44 ↗ using a different device such as a

0:46 ↗ smartphone or tablet

0:48 ↗ use the call-in information in the

0:49 ↗ meeting invite to call into the meeting

0:52 ↗ if you're meeting by phone

0:54 ↗ um attendance stephen could you please

0:56 ↗ call world tonight

1:00 ↗ yes

1:01 ↗ um

1:02 ↗ commissioner lewis

1:04 ↗ here

1:05 ↗ commissioner monahan

1:07 ↗ here

1:08 ↗ commissioner milligan

1:10 ↗ here commissioner vader

1:13 ↗ here

1:14 ↗ commissioner voice

1:18 ↗ here

1:20 ↗ and kelly is excused for tonight

1:27 ↗ thank you stephen

1:29 ↗ excellent

1:31 ↗ now this part of the agenda is for our

1:33 ↗ general public comment they're a serious

1:35 ↗ part of the process

1:36 ↗ and they do factor into the decisions we

1:38 ↗ make here

1:40 ↗ for the members of the public who are

1:42 ↗ joining us welcome and if there is

1:44 ↗ anyone in the meeting now who would like

1:45 ↗ to make public comments please raise

1:47 ↗ your hand

1:48 ↗ to do this if you're on a phone please

1:50 ↗ press three

1:51 ↗ and if you have joined by computer or

1:53 ↗ smartphone look for the hand icon and

1:56 ↗ this does vary by device

1:58 ↗ when recognized please unmute your

2:00 ↗ microphone

2:01 ↗ state your name

2:03 ↗ speak clearly and pause frequently

2:05 ↗ limit your comments to five minutes or

2:07 ↗ less and then

2:08 ↗ mute your microphone when you're

2:09 ↗ finished

2:11 ↗ if you do not respond or for some reason

2:13 ↗ your connection is lost the meeting will

2:15 ↗ need to proceed

2:16 ↗ you're encouraged to rejoin the meeting

2:18 ↗ if you are able

2:20 ↗ stephen how do we have anyone tonight

2:22 ↗ signed up for public comment

2:24 ↗ no one signed up uh prior to the meeting

2:26 ↗ and i'm not seeing any additional

2:28 ↗ members of the public on the attendee

2:29 ↗ list

2:32 ↗ so i do not see any public comment for

2:34 ↗ tonight

2:37 ↗ all right thank you stephen

2:39 ↗ the next item on the agenda is training

2:42 ↗ training for all of us

2:44 ↗ and tonight tisha will be

2:46 ↗ presenting um

2:48 ↗ or city training so i hand it over to

2:50 ↗ tisha

2:55 ↗ hi everybody give me just a minute here

2:57 ↗ and i'll get my

2:59 ↗ trusty powerpoint going

3:04 ↗ see

3:06 ↗ you're seeing my notes let me

3:09 ↗ kiss that

3:15 ↗ oh are you still seeing my notes

3:18 ↗ you are oh interesting my trusty trick

3:21 ↗ isn't working

3:24 ↗ i'll try one more time

3:28 ↗ oh goodness okay

3:33 ↗ well

3:34 ↗ you're just gonna get a preview

3:37 ↗ or did that fix it

3:39 ↗ that fixed it okay i don't know what i

3:41 ↗ did but uh we'll we'll take it all right

3:43 ↗ well um i want to start by thanking you

3:46 ↗ i know um i know from viewing our

3:48 ↗ website calendar and monitoring our

3:50 ↗ board and commission agendas that you

3:52 ↗ have been meeting a lot um on some

3:55 ↗ really in-depth topics and

3:58 ↗ i just continue to be so impressed by

4:00 ↗ the

4:01 ↗ um level of volunteerism we have in our

4:03 ↗ community and just want to thank you for

4:05 ↗ dedicating so many of your evenings to

4:08 ↗ um

4:09 ↗ helping helping us um plan for a

4:11 ↗ brighter future in issaquah

4:13 ↗ and i know you're you're veterans on the

4:15 ↗ commission so this material is um

4:18 ↗ material you've gone over before um we

4:21 ↗ provide this open public meeting

4:24 ↗ meetings act and public records act

4:26 ↗ training um every year to all of our

4:28 ↗ boarding commission members

4:30 ↗ we think it's important and it helps

4:33 ↗ protect you as you're informed about

4:35 ↗ some of the expectations around your

4:37 ↗ role

4:38 ↗ and then tonight we also have anne marie

4:41 ↗ soto from the

4:42 ↗ madrona law group which is the city's

4:44 ↗ contracted law firm and she's going to

4:47 ↗ cover a portion of tonight's training so

4:49 ↗ we're going to go over that required

4:51 ↗ public records act and open public

4:53 ↗ meetings act training and then we'll go

4:54 ↗ into a couple other topics that are

4:56 ↗ shown here

4:58 ↗ um and again because because you have

5:00 ↗ all served on the committee for um some

5:02 ↗ time we'll we'll touch on things lightly

5:04 ↗ and then if you have um questions just

5:07 ↗ you know raise your hand or indicate in

5:09 ↗ the chat and stephen or chair um please

5:12 ↗ feel free to interrupt and and let us

5:14 ↗ know

5:15 ↗ if you have questions along the way so

5:16 ↗ i'll get started

5:18 ↗ so um the first part of this training is

5:21 ↗ to just provide your refresher on the

5:23 ↗ washington state um we call them the

5:25 ↗ sunshine laws that uh the intention of

5:29 ↗ these um two laws the open public

5:31 ↗ meetings act and the public records

5:32 ↗ actor just to ensure transparency and

5:34 ↗ access

5:36 ↗ to government and so uh we'll touch on

5:38 ↗ both of these

5:40 ↗ we we as i mentioned we provide this

5:42 ↗ training to all of the city's boards and

5:43 ↗ commissions um annually but particularly

5:46 ↗ new members but we actually like to give

5:48 ↗ all members just a quick refresher um

5:50 ↗ because there are some um impacts if we

5:53 ↗ don't abide by um these open government

5:56 ↗ laws uh so we feel it's important to

5:57 ↗ keep you educated and um just free from

6:00 ↗ from gray area

6:03 ↗ so um you know a primary focus of the

6:06 ↗ open public meetings act is is that you

6:08 ↗ know this thought that the public is

6:10 ↗ entitled to hear discussion um

6:12 ↗ pertaining to city business by our

6:14 ↗ governing body the council and the

6:16 ↗ city's advisory boards and so we um

6:19 ↗ we go to efforts to publish all your

6:21 ↗ meeting agendas in advance during the

6:23 ↗ time of of covet and virtual meetings

6:25 ↗ we've been publishing all of the

6:26 ↗ information to join your your meetings

6:29 ↗ uh via webex and when you return to in

6:32 ↗ person meetings the the doors will be

6:34 ↗ open so anyone is able to come and again

6:36 ↗ we provide advanced notice at typically

6:39 ↗ at least three days notice of your

6:41 ↗ meeting date time and location

6:47 ↗ um you have your regular meetings uh

6:50 ↗ which are twice monthly i uh stephen

6:52 ↗ caught a typo in the presentation at 6

6:54 ↗ 30 p.m is your standard meeting time um

6:57 ↗ in your standard meeting location is the

6:58 ↗ council chambers but of course during

7:00 ↗ covid we've continued to meet virtually

7:03 ↗ you've got your first in-person meeting

7:05 ↗ coming up here in july and we'll talk

7:07 ↗ about that in just a minute um just

7:09 ↗ something to note that we bring up is

7:11 ↗ that any time you meet at a different

7:12 ↗ time place location

7:15 ↗ um it's considered a special meeting and

7:17 ↗ there are some restrictions for special

7:20 ↗ meetings which are just that you're

7:21 ↗ limited to discussing and taking action

7:23 ↗ on items on your meeting agenda so

7:26 ↗ there's not the ability to sort of um

7:29 ↗ talk about or take action on something

7:30 ↗ that's that's not on your agenda and

7:32 ↗ that's unique for special meetings even

7:35 ↗ though i i know most of our boards and

7:37 ↗ commissions you know follow their

7:38 ↗ agendas pretty consistently no matter

7:40 ↗ what the type of meeting but something

7:43 ↗ we like to make you aware of and we take

7:45 ↗ special care when we're preparing your

7:46 ↗ special meeting agendas to make sure

7:48 ↗ they're comprehensive

7:51 ↗ um you've been uh you've had a lot of

7:54 ↗ joint meetings lately so this is just a

7:56 ↗ reminder here that meetings can look

7:58 ↗ look different um depending on the

8:01 ↗ format um but as i mentioned we provide

8:04 ↗ your agendas in advance so people know

8:07 ↗ where to attend how to attend how to

8:09 ↗ comment um and then we also prepare

8:11 ↗ minutes and just ensure that access to

8:14 ↗ the materials and the action that you

8:16 ↗ take um also uh public comment is taken

8:19 ↗ at it all of your uh regular meetings

8:21 ↗ and we'll have some discussion on that

8:23 ↗ under your rules and regulations tonight

8:26 ↗ and that is something that's strongly

8:28 ↗ encouraged though not required by the

8:30 ↗ open public meetings act

8:34 ↗ um there are a few reasons by which you

8:36 ↗ can have a closed session that it does

8:38 ↗ not occur frequently at ppc you just

8:41 ↗ mention it so that if there is a

8:42 ↗ situation where

8:44 ↗ we ask you to go into a closed session

8:46 ↗ you know that that is legitimate but

8:47 ↗ there are a lot of rules around when and

8:49 ↗ how we do that so we will we will give

8:52 ↗ you a heads up if this needs to occur

8:55 ↗ and again there's particular reasons

8:57 ↗ like you know litigation or certain um

9:01 ↗ certain actions that can be more

9:02 ↗ sensitive that typically are handled by

9:04 ↗ our city council

9:08 ↗ so uh we're going to touch on a quorum

9:10 ↗ real quick so a quorum of of the

9:12 ↗ planning policy commission is four

9:14 ↗ members

9:15 ↗ um so it's just a number to be mindful

9:17 ↗ of you know one of the things um two two

9:19 ↗ of the things i'd like to mention here

9:21 ↗ are um we you know the goal of the open

9:24 ↗ public meetings act is we want any

9:26 ↗ discussions you have as a group to be

9:28 ↗ public and available for anyone to to

9:31 ↗ hear so it means we need to

9:34 ↗ work to avoid any of those um

9:36 ↗ discussion or actions outside of a

9:38 ↗ meeting

9:39 ↗ however um travel

9:41 ↗ gathering social gatherings a social

9:43 ↗ barbecue um getting together again for a

9:45 ↗ purely social event where you're talking

9:47 ↗ about families or you know kind of a get

9:49 ↗ to know you activity outside of the

9:51 ↗ meeting is perfectly fine um we do not

9:54 ↗ need to publish an agenda for that you

9:56 ↗ just need to monitor your conversations

9:58 ↗ um but we do ask that you not you know

10:01 ↗ attend events pertaining to business to

10:04 ↗ come before the ppc um as a group and i

10:07 ↗ i don't think that's likely to happen we

10:09 ↗ do have some boards that participate in

10:11 ↗ a lot of reach more regional um

10:14 ↗ topical events so we just ask ask you to

10:17 ↗ to think about that if there's a

10:19 ↗ community or regional event that um the

10:22 ↗ commission's made aware of that we would

10:24 ↗ ask you to avoid having four of you

10:27 ↗ there again i don't think that's highly

10:29 ↗ likely to occur but something to be

10:31 ↗ aware of and that um stephen

10:33 ↗ and your staff will remind you of if

10:35 ↗ there's an event um coming up to avoid

10:37 ↗ that

10:38 ↗ quorum

10:40 ↗ the other thing i want to mention here

10:41 ↗ is a serial meeting um this is when

10:45 ↗ you inadvertently kind of get some

10:48 ↗ collective um input from a total of four

10:52 ↗ commissioners um the way this can happen

10:54 ↗ is through email you know forwarding an

10:56 ↗ email with thoughts

10:58 ↗ responding to an email then forwarding

10:59 ↗ it to another commissioner who might

11:01 ↗ reply and include another commissioner

11:03 ↗ and eventually there might be a string

11:07 ↗ of input on a topic um that totals for

11:10 ↗ commissioners and we want to really

11:12 ↗ avoid that which is why we really

11:13 ↗ encourage you if you have email um

11:17 ↗ have an email you'd like to share with

11:18 ↗ the commission that you do so through

11:21 ↗ stephen or one of your other liaisons it

11:22 ↗ just really protects you from um

11:25 ↗ avoiding that situation of

11:28 ↗ inadvertently or advertently

11:31 ↗ collecting input from multiple

11:32 ↗ commissioners uh it's also helpful from

11:35 ↗ a public records perspective we'll talk

11:37 ↗ about that in a minute

11:39 ↗ uh this also the string meeting also

11:41 ↗ pertains to discussion so while it's

11:43 ↗ totally appropriate to talk to one or

11:45 ↗ two of your commissioners to see how

11:47 ↗ they're feeling about an issue it

11:48 ↗ wouldn't be appropriate to talk to one

11:49 ↗ or two commissioners and then talk to a

11:52 ↗ third commissioner and relay everything

11:54 ↗ you heard from the first two with the

11:57 ↗ third you've got now got four of you

11:58 ↗ kind of talking outside a meeting so

12:01 ↗ those are the things we want you to be

12:02 ↗ mindful of and aware of

12:04 ↗ um if you have questions

12:06 ↗ now or in the future you can

12:08 ↗ let the clerk's office or uh steven

12:11 ↗ know and we can we can help provide

12:13 ↗ advice

12:14 ↗ there are some personal penalties here

12:17 ↗ um that are shown on the screen

12:19 ↗ so uh we just want to make you aware of

12:22 ↗ those

12:26 ↗ all right so let's talk about the public

12:28 ↗ records act um i just have one slide

12:31 ↗ here and just a couple points to touch

12:32 ↗ on again i know you've you've all heard

12:34 ↗ this before in some form or fashion so

12:37 ↗ um

12:38 ↗ the city clerk is the i'm the designated

12:40 ↗ public records officer the clerk's

12:41 ↗ office responds to all our public

12:43 ↗ disclosure requests so i'm sure you're

12:45 ↗ aware as a government agency um almost

12:48 ↗ all of our records are uh need to be

12:50 ↗ made available to the public and so

12:52 ↗ anyone can request any record from us

12:55 ↗ and we are obligated to provide it with

12:57 ↗ with some certain exemptions for privacy

12:59 ↗ and you know certain particular records

13:01 ↗ we can exempt

13:03 ↗ um

13:04 ↗ what this means is that um you know your

13:07 ↗ records that are produced um within the

13:09 ↗ purview of your role as a commissioner

13:10 ↗ could be requested and if so we would

13:13 ↗ reach out to you to see if you had any

13:16 ↗ records that were responsive to the

13:18 ↗ request by and large you're mostly

13:20 ↗ dealing with city records right we

13:21 ↗ produce an agenda we send it to you that

13:24 ↗ contains all of your information when

13:26 ↗ you're emailing like i mentioned that's

13:27 ↗ why we encourage you to copy or work

13:30 ↗ through city staff because those

13:32 ↗ messages are all captured you know in

13:34 ↗ our city systems um what we might ask

13:36 ↗ you for though

13:38 ↗ are emails between you and a member of

13:39 ↗ the public or you and another

13:41 ↗ commissioner that never went through the

13:42 ↗ city system

13:44 ↗ for that reason we recommend that you

13:45 ↗ have a separate email account to keep

13:48 ↗ things just really neat and tidy so if

13:51 ↗ we needed to request records from you

13:52 ↗ it'd be

13:53 ↗ very easy for you to identify those or

13:55 ↗ search those um and it wouldn't

13:57 ↗ implicate a personal uh email account um

14:00 ↗ you know the other option is to just

14:03 ↗ remain highly organized with your

14:04 ↗ personal email um so that you could

14:07 ↗ easily identify those messages um but

14:10 ↗ again

14:11 ↗ it it's definitely cleaner if they're if

14:14 ↗ they're all together and not you know

14:16 ↗ intermixed with uh other unrelated email

14:20 ↗ if you have questions about this please

14:22 ↗ raise your hand or and let me know i

14:24 ↗ know anne marie can also speak um to

14:27 ↗ this topic

14:28 ↗ um so as i mentioned

14:31 ↗ keep your records organized if you keep

14:33 ↗ notes or things related to your work uh

14:36 ↗ your time on the commission

14:39 ↗ those those notes you take are

14:41 ↗ considered transitory records so you can

14:43 ↗ dispose of those after the meeting

14:46 ↗ or you know a month or year from the

14:47 ↗ meeting

14:48 ↗ the city doesn't need them

14:51 ↗ if you have them and you haven't

14:53 ↗ disposed of them and we get a

14:55 ↗ records request we would reach out to

14:57 ↗ you and ask you if you had any notes and

14:59 ↗ would ask for them however so we

15:01 ↗ encourage sort of a routine of of

15:04 ↗ disposing of those notes so that you're

15:06 ↗ um

15:07 ↗ not having if we reach out to you you're

15:09 ↗ not having to pull pull out you know

15:12 ↗ binders full of content so encourage

15:14 ↗ just routine um disposal of notes once

15:18 ↗ they're no longer needed

15:20 ↗ and uh the last bullet here there's just

15:23 ↗ a legal obligation to search so you're

15:25 ↗ you're our partners in providing um

15:27 ↗ responses to requests that might pertain

15:29 ↗ to the the commission's work

15:31 ↗ uh and with that i'm going to turn it

15:34 ↗ over to anne-marie to talk a little bit

15:36 ↗ about ethics

15:39 ↗ all right good evening everyone thank

15:40 ↗ you so much for being here this evening

15:44 ↗ i'm going to just be going over a couple

15:46 ↗ of really quick um slides regarding the

15:49 ↗ city's code of ethics so the code of

15:52 ↗ ethics really covers things such as

15:54 ↗ conflicts of interest

15:56 ↗ gifts and gratuities like what you can

15:58 ↗ and cannot accept and political activity

16:02 ↗ that you might be engaged in what is and

16:04 ↗ what is not allowed the

16:06 ↗ policy and the guidelines for the city's

16:09 ↗ code of ethics are available on the

16:11 ↗ city's website

16:13 ↗ but these things really

16:15 ↗ they really help to reinforce the

16:17 ↗ importance of things such as the open

16:20 ↗ public meetings act and public records

16:22 ↗ requirements

16:26 ↗ next slide

16:28 ↗ all right as part of your

16:31 ↗ responsibilities as commission members

16:33 ↗ you also have to sign the online

16:37 ↗ acknowledgement form

16:39 ↗ you can get to that form through this

16:41 ↗ link that's included in this powerpoint

16:50 ↗ all right anne marie i think it's back

16:52 ↗ to me already

16:54 ↗ you have more to come and again i'm just

16:56 ↗ gonna touch on this really lightly here

16:58 ↗ but we have a few slides just as some

17:00 ↗ reminders about um the role of of uh

17:04 ↗ commission members um so we're gonna

17:06 ↗ quickly cover these three things

17:09 ↗ um and i'm so sorry i have an

17:12 ↗ interrupter here excuse me

17:26 ↗ so sorry i'm i'm single parenting

17:28 ↗ tonight so

17:29 ↗ um

17:31 ↗ okay so uh we're gonna talk about

17:34 ↗ attendance which you know during kova

17:36 ↗ this has been a real benefit to the

17:37 ↗ virtual meetings i think it's made

17:39 ↗ attendance much much easier um

17:42 ↗ we will talk in just a minute about the

17:44 ↗ return to in-person meetings and we do

17:46 ↗ you know sort of want to remind and

17:48 ↗ encourage you to

17:49 ↗ use

17:50 ↗ your um excused absences so if you're

17:53 ↗ unwell um if you have planned travel you

17:56 ↗ know we are at this time uh going to be

17:59 ↗ uh requiring boarding commission members

18:02 ↗ to attend meetings in person and so this

18:05 ↗ this function of providing uh city staff

18:08 ↗ notice of your planned travel and

18:10 ↗ anticipated excused absences is

18:12 ↗ important

18:14 ↗ for planning purposes and to ensure we

18:15 ↗ have a quorum we know you're also going

18:18 ↗ to have unplanned absences and just do

18:20 ↗ your best to provide as much advance

18:22 ↗ notice as you can

18:23 ↗ um

18:24 ↗ to staff again we we encourage five-day

18:27 ↗ advance notice but realize that it's

18:29 ↗ just not not always possible

18:32 ↗ um the uh city's been working on uh

18:36 ↗ plans for return in-person meetings so

18:38 ↗ the governor had a sort of very

18:40 ↗ long-standing proclamation sort of

18:41 ↗ prohibiting in in person requiring

18:44 ↗ virtual meetings and making the

18:45 ↗ in-person element optional that

18:47 ↗ proclamation was terminated yesterday

18:51 ↗ however the state legislature

18:55 ↗ had some foresight to amend the open

18:58 ↗ public meetings act during this last

19:00 ↗ legislative session and they carved out

19:02 ↗ a provision allowing for

19:04 ↗ all remote meetings

19:06 ↗ during a state of emergency if a

19:08 ↗ reasonable um

19:12 ↗ if if necessary to ensure reasonable

19:14 ↗ safety i'm not quoting that exactly

19:16 ↗ correctly um but basically it gives

19:19 ↗ local agencies an opportunity while the

19:22 ↗ covet emergency is in place to continue

19:24 ↗ to have all virtual meetings but the

19:26 ↗ city's working towards bringing all the

19:28 ↗ boards and commissions back um in person

19:31 ↗ the city council has been operating in

19:33 ↗ person since march

19:36 ↗ however uh we will be continuing to

19:39 ↗ offer a virtual component for members of

19:41 ↗ the public um and and on occasion uh

19:44 ↗ some of your presenters as well

19:47 ↗ so

19:48 ↗ your first meeting in july uh is july

19:51 ↗ 14th so we will have uh you know barring

19:54 ↗ any um

19:56 ↗ you know this this all could change

19:58 ↗ we're trying to be flexible here with

20:00 ↗ covid case counts and whatnot

20:02 ↗ so i you know stay tuned but our current

20:05 ↗ plans are to bring you back in person on

20:08 ↗ july 14th and you will be seated at the

20:11 ↗ dice um

20:13 ↗ can certainly choose to wear a mask if

20:14 ↗ you would like to

20:16 ↗ and uh

20:17 ↗ get back into that whole in-person

20:20 ↗ meeting dynamic so

20:21 ↗ i wanted to take a moment to mention

20:23 ↗ that again if you have any questions let

20:25 ↗ me know or

20:27 ↗ let stephen know

20:30 ↗ and then you know i think i'm going to

20:32 ↗ roll past this section on alternates you

20:34 ↗ know it's something we'd like to

20:35 ↗ highlight it where the city is a little

20:37 ↗ unique and having alternates so we

20:38 ↗ always like to clarify how that works i

20:40 ↗ don't understand you have a few

20:41 ↗ vacancies right now so you you ever

20:44 ↗ pretty much everyone serving as a

20:45 ↗ regular member at all times so i'm going

20:48 ↗ to move past this i also know you're

20:50 ↗ very familiar with your meeting agendas

20:52 ↗ so i'm going to move move on down to

20:55 ↗ anne marie's section here

20:57 ↗ all right tisha just

20:59 ↗ wanted to give me more time since i only

21:01 ↗ got like 10 seconds the last time so

21:04 ↗ we'll just jump right into public

21:06 ↗ hearings right next slide

21:10 ↗ so there are two types of public

21:12 ↗ hearings that you'll see

21:14 ↗ there are the legislative public

21:16 ↗ hearings that's when you're trying to

21:19 ↗ obtain input on legislative policy

21:21 ↗ matters and then you have quasi-judicial

21:23 ↗ public hearings and that's when you're

21:26 ↗ going to be essentially the decider of

21:30 ↗ the rights of specific identified

21:32 ↗ parties typically with respect to like a

21:35 ↗ land use application

21:41 ↗ so

21:41 ↗ what you're going to be seeing most

21:43 ↗ frequently are the legislative

21:45 ↗ public hearings so this is where you're

21:47 ↗ acting like a legislator you are

21:50 ↗ making decisions that will affect the

21:52 ↗ community as a whole not any specific

21:56 ↗ identified parties when you're having

21:58 ↗ legislative public hearings there is a

22:01 ↗ requirement for notice to the public and

22:04 ↗ also a reasonable opportunity for

22:07 ↗ members of the public to be heard

22:09 ↗ the type of notice that's required is

22:11 ↗ typically set up by statute or in your

22:14 ↗ city's code

22:16 ↗ and then the notice has to describe what

22:18 ↗ it is that you're going to be doing so

22:20 ↗ what is the action that's going to be

22:22 ↗ under consideration by the commission so

22:25 ↗ that it gives members of the public

22:27 ↗ enough notice as to what you're going to

22:29 ↗ be talking about so that they can have

22:31 ↗ an informed opportunity to provide a

22:34 ↗ comment on that topic

22:39 ↗ so at when what does that really mean

22:42 ↗ what is that opportunity to be heard so

22:45 ↗ all members of the public have to be

22:47 ↗ allowed an opportunity to speak um and

22:50 ↗ that's whether it can be in writing or

22:53 ↗ it can be orally depending on the

22:55 ↗ certain situation

22:57 ↗ you are allowed to have reasonable rules

23:00 ↗ for how you accept that public testimony

23:04 ↗ they can be things that are really

23:06 ↗ dealing with the time place in the

23:08 ↗ manner of how that testimony can be

23:10 ↗ provided so you can provide things like

23:13 ↗ time limits or

23:15 ↗ codes of conduct for members of the

23:17 ↗ public when they're giving their um

23:19 ↗ their public comment

23:21 ↗ um but when you do have those rules you

23:23 ↗ should say those at the very beginning

23:25 ↗ of the public hearing so everybody

23:28 ↗ understands what the rules are what the

23:30 ↗ boundaries are for that public comment

23:36 ↗ so typically when you're dealing with

23:39 ↗ your legislative hearings you're going

23:40 ↗ to have decision criteria and again

23:42 ↗ that's going to be either outlined in

23:44 ↗ statute or in the city's municipal code

23:48 ↗ most of the stuff that you're going to

23:49 ↗ be dealing with is going to be outlined

23:51 ↗ within the imc

23:53 ↗ if there isn't any set criteria then you

23:57 ↗ can use a policy judgment as to how to

24:00 ↗ um

24:01 ↗ how to decide on that particular matter

24:04 ↗ that's before the commission

24:06 ↗ you're not really limited to just that

24:09 ↗ testimony and the documents however that

24:11 ↗ are presented during the hearing you can

24:13 ↗ still obtain other information to help

24:16 ↗ to inform your decision

24:22 ↗ the next type of public hearing are a

24:24 ↗ question due quasi-judicial hearings um

24:27 ↗ these are not as common with the ppc as

24:30 ↗ they are with for example the

24:32 ↗ development commission but it is still

24:34 ↗ something that you will encounter from

24:35 ↗ time to time so it's important to make

24:37 ↗ sure that you understand what the role

24:39 ↗ is when you are acting in a

24:41 ↗ quasi-judicial capacity so here you're

24:44 ↗ really acting like a judge so this is

24:46 ↗ like you're a court um you're holding

24:49 ↗ the hearing so you can gather evidence

24:52 ↗ and then you're making findings that are

24:53 ↗ based on the evidence that's provided in

24:56 ↗ that hearing

24:58 ↗ this you're really going to be looking

25:00 ↗ at the criteria that's outlined again in

25:03 ↗ statute or on code and then applying the

25:06 ↗ facts and the evidence that's been

25:08 ↗ provided

25:09 ↗ to the criteria so that you can then

25:11 ↗ make a decision and these again as i

25:14 ↗ explained earlier these are decisions

25:16 ↗ that affect the rights of specific

25:18 ↗ people

25:19 ↗ you're the applicant of whatever the

25:21 ↗ matter is before the commission rather

25:23 ↗ than the public as a whole

25:32 ↗ all right so when you're when you have

25:35 ↗ question judicial matters before you

25:37 ↗ again you are going to have rules of

25:40 ↗ procedure that are going to guide how

25:42 ↗ you

25:43 ↗ are

25:44 ↗ undertaking that particular matter

25:47 ↗ in the absence of rules then you should

25:50 ↗ work out a procedure in advance there

25:52 ↗ are times where they're going to be

25:54 ↗ special circumstances and so you have to

25:56 ↗ come up with rules that are going to

25:57 ↗ apply to that particular matter

26:00 ↗ when you do that again you want to make

26:02 ↗ sure that you announce what those rules

26:04 ↗ are

26:05 ↗ at the outset of the hearing so that

26:07 ↗ everybody understands what the rules are

26:10 ↗ that are going to apply for the penancy

26:12 ↗ of that particular matter

26:14 ↗ the party with the burden of proof will

26:17 ↗ be the party that goes first and then

26:20 ↗ the other parties such as you know city

26:23 ↗ staff members of the public opponents of

26:25 ↗ the project they then get a chance to

26:28 ↗ present their evidence in their side

26:31 ↗ and then again the person who has the

26:34 ↗ burden of proof they get a chance to

26:37 ↗ rebut anything that was raised by

26:40 ↗ the

26:41 ↗ opponents of the project

26:43 ↗ and then commissioners get the

26:44 ↗ opportunity to ask questions during the

26:47 ↗ hearing to help you to make your

26:48 ↗ decision

26:53 ↗ when you have quasi-judicial matters

26:55 ↗ that are before you then the appearance

26:57 ↗ of fairness will apply

27:00 ↗ what that means is that the proceedings

27:02 ↗ have to be fair

27:04 ↗ and they have to appear

27:06 ↗ fair so there's a test to determine

27:10 ↗ whether or not the appearance of

27:12 ↗ fairness has been implicated and that's

27:14 ↗ whether a fair-minded person observing

27:16 ↗ the proceedings and having essentially

27:19 ↗ no part in the proceedings would be able

27:22 ↗ to conclude that the the proceedings

27:25 ↗ were fair

27:27 ↗ so

27:28 ↗ this is a reasonable disinterested

27:30 ↗ person standard the focus is ultimately

27:33 ↗ on the decision maker's relationship

27:36 ↗ with the persons who are affected by the

27:39 ↗ decision um so this basically means that

27:42 ↗ if you have like a special relationship

27:45 ↗ you know it's a friend or a family

27:48 ↗ member or it's a business partner your

27:51 ↗ employer if you stand to benefit or

27:54 ↗ someone that you have a close

27:56 ↗ relationship stance to benefit from the

27:58 ↗ decision

27:59 ↗ then you may be precluded from hearing

28:02 ↗ the matter under the appearance of

28:04 ↗ fairness the appearance of fairness also

28:07 ↗ prohibits ex-parte communications

28:09 ↗ regarding the matter

28:11 ↗ with the proponents and opponents of the

28:13 ↗ project what that means is you can't

28:16 ↗ have outside of the hearing

28:19 ↗ conversations with for example the

28:21 ↗ applicant of the project or with

28:24 ↗ neighbors who are

28:26 ↗ against a project those are decisions or

28:29 ↗ those are discussions that need to occur

28:32 ↗ in the public hearing however if those

28:36 ↗ discussions do occur uh there's still an

28:38 ↗ opportunity to remedy any particular any

28:41 ↗ uh appear or ex parte communications by

28:44 ↗ disclosing the content of communication

28:47 ↗ on the record and allowing others an

28:49 ↗ opportunity to object to the

28:51 ↗ commissioner's

28:52 ↗ continued involvement in the matter

28:54 ↗ based on that particular communication

29:01 ↗ which i

29:03 ↗ i guess i already covered this so that's

29:05 ↗ again that's how you cure those

29:06 ↗ appearance of fairness uh issues is

29:10 ↗ again by

29:11 ↗ disclosing the content of communication

29:13 ↗ and then giving people an opportunity to

29:16 ↗ object one thing to note however is if

29:19 ↗ you have so many people

29:21 ↗ recusing themselves that you don't have

29:23 ↗ a quorum anymore then the rule of

29:24 ↗ necessity might come into play uh where

29:28 ↗ there uh you you may allow people to

29:31 ↗ continue to

29:33 ↗ serve in capacity as commissioner

29:36 ↗ if that would mean that there won't be

29:38 ↗ enough people to have a quorum to hear

29:41 ↗ the particular matter

29:46 ↗ so when you're dealing with those

29:48 ↗ quasi-judicial decisions the deploration

29:53 ↗ deliberations can occur immediately

29:55 ↗ following the hearing or they can happen

29:57 ↗ at a later date really that is going to

30:00 ↗ depend on the timing

30:02 ↗ the commissioners either might want time

30:04 ↗ to digest the information

30:06 ↗ or they uh there might just not be

30:09 ↗ enough time in that particular evening

30:11 ↗ you know it's close to 10 o'clock or you

30:14 ↗ know later than that and you want to

30:16 ↗ just save it until another time

30:19 ↗ the decisions just like the other

30:21 ↗ matters that we already talked about

30:22 ↗ have to be based on criteria that's in

30:24 ↗ your code

30:26 ↗ and the decision must be based on the

30:28 ↗ record so on the things like the

30:31 ↗ testimony and the evidence that is

30:33 ↗ provided in the context of the the

30:36 ↗ hearing and not by doing research on

30:39 ↗ your own having conversations outside of

30:42 ↗ the hearing those are the things that

30:44 ↗ are prohibited

30:48 ↗ so

30:49 ↗ finally we'll talk about legal

30:51 ↗ challenges to decisions of the city

30:57 ↗ so when you're dealing with legal

30:59 ↗ challenges you have to make sure that

31:00 ↗ procedural due process has been followed

31:03 ↗ again parties have to be given adequate

31:05 ↗ notice and a meaningful opportunity to

31:07 ↗ be heard and you have to follow those

31:09 ↗ procedures that are outlined in the

31:12 ↗ municipal code or in statute

31:16 ↗ there's also next slide yeah sorry

31:19 ↗ there's also substantive due process and

31:22 ↗ that's where you need to make sure that

31:24 ↗ the legislation is serving a legitimate

31:26 ↗ public purpose and that it's not

31:28 ↗ arbitrary or irrational

31:35 ↗ so when we're dealing with land use

31:38 ↗ decisions

31:40 ↗ any challenges to land use decisions

31:43 ↗ are heard through

31:45 ↗ the procedures outlined in state law

31:48 ↗ under the land use petition act

31:50 ↗ land use decisions can be appealed to

31:53 ↗ the superior court under the land use

31:55 ↗ petition act or lupa as it's referred to

31:58 ↗ as shorthand the court will then review

32:01 ↗ whether the decision um

32:04 ↗ was supported by substantial evidence in

32:06 ↗ the record with the whether it was based

32:09 ↗ on an erroneous interpretation of an

32:12 ↗ ordinance or other law

32:13 ↗ whether it was based on a clearly

32:15 ↗ erroneous application of the law to the

32:17 ↗ facts

32:19 ↗ whether it was based on a procedural

32:21 ↗ error that was not harmless

32:23 ↗ whether it was outside of the

32:25 ↗ jurisdiction of that particular decision

32:27 ↗ maker or whether it violates the

32:30 ↗ constitutional rights of any party

32:32 ↗ and if so then the decision may be

32:35 ↗ overturned

32:36 ↗ and the review is uh based on the record

32:39 ↗ that has been prepared by the

32:41 ↗ jurisdiction and no new evidence is

32:44 ↗ taken so at the outset of lupa the uh

32:48 ↗ the jurisdiction will prepare the record

32:50 ↗ that was

32:51 ↗ used for the decision maker to make

32:55 ↗ their decision

33:04 ↗ all right

33:05 ↗ and it looks like we made it to the end

33:09 ↗ and so here's both mine and tisha's

33:11 ↗ contact information

33:19 ↗ all right chair that concludes our

33:20 ↗ presentation

33:23 ↗ well thank you tisha and anne marie i

33:25 ↗ appreciate the presentation it doesn't

33:26 ↗ appear that we have any questions

33:28 ↗ because your presentation is so thorough

33:31 ↗ and

33:32 ↗ possibly because we have heard it once

33:33 ↗ or twice

33:35 ↗ thank you both very much we appreciate

33:37 ↗ you guys coming

33:38 ↗ here tonight and uh helping to educate

33:40 ↗ us

33:43 ↗ all right so

33:44 ↗ now we move on to topic number four

33:47 ↗ which is the adoption of the

33:48 ↗ commission's rules and regulations

33:50 ↗ and

33:51 ↗ what i'm kind of thinking and hoping

33:53 ↗ that somebody out there will agree with

33:55 ↗ me

33:56 ↗ is possibly making a motion to approve

34:00 ↗ um the rules and regulations and then as

34:02 ↗ we move through the topics because

34:04 ↗ there's some that we don't even have

34:06 ↗ action required unless we want to

34:08 ↗ and then we can possibly because i

34:09 ↗ believe there's eight amendments

34:12 ↗ if there's any deliberation or

34:14 ↗ contention then on those particular

34:16 ↗ particular topics we can open it up for

34:19 ↗ discussion

34:20 ↗ um debate make a motion

34:23 ↗ and then vote

34:24 ↗ so

34:25 ↗ it might be just a cleaner and easier

34:27 ↗ way to go about this

34:29 ↗ um just by opening it up

34:31 ↗ making that motion and then starting to

34:34 ↗ have steven present for us

34:40 ↗ yeah i'll make a motion to adopt the

34:41 ↗ replacement rule that's presented in the

34:43 ↗ materials with the minor changes

34:45 ↗ received from the commission

34:49 ↗ we have a second

34:52 ↗ chair i'll second it

34:56 ↗ nina milligan

34:59 ↗ thank you commissioner milligan thank

35:00 ↗ you commissioner monaghan vice chairman

35:03 ↗ um stephen i believe you are up for the

35:05 ↗ presentation of the amendments to our

35:07 ↗ rules and regs

35:10 ↗ great thank you

35:12 ↗ can you let me know if you see my

35:14 ↗ presentation perfect

35:17 ↗ so tonight i'm going to talk about the

35:19 ↗ the replacement rules and regulation

35:20 ↗ amendments um

35:22 ↗ several i received from

35:24 ↗ commissioners and several were proposed

35:26 ↗ or at least brought up by staff in the

35:29 ↗ material memo so just really quickly the

35:32 ↗ overview of the replacement regulate or

35:35 ↗ the replacement rules

35:36 ↗ is that it's it's regularly updated to

35:39 ↗ incorporate best practices that are

35:41 ↗ reviewed and approved by the city clerk

35:43 ↗ as well as the city attorney and then it

35:45 ↗ also maintains consistency with how the

35:48 ↗ other boards and commissions um

35:51 ↗ adopt their own rules and regulations

35:53 ↗ and maintains our own consistency as a

35:56 ↗ as a commission

35:57 ↗ in terms of how we operate

36:00 ↗ the

36:02 ↗ replacement rules came from the draft or

36:04 ↗ were drafted from the development

36:05 ↗ commission's latest

36:07 ↗ uh rules and regulations which were

36:09 ↗ adopted last year

36:11 ↗ the major the biggest changes that we

36:13 ↗ added to our own rules and regulations

36:15 ↗ came with the addition of the public

36:16 ↗ hearings

36:17 ↗ and then i we added in minor

36:20 ↗ commissioner edits um which didn't

36:23 ↗ change any

36:24 ↗ intent or

36:26 ↗ any of the context of a lot of the

36:28 ↗ language that were presented in the

36:29 ↗ materials

36:31 ↗ but if the commissioner would like to

36:32 ↗ see those uh let me know once i run

36:35 ↗ through each of the amendments

36:37 ↗ so tonight we have six amendments that

36:38 ↗ will be just going through and

36:40 ↗ discussing um as chair voice had

36:45 ↗ kind of indicated we're going to go

36:46 ↗ through each one with each of the

36:48 ↗ options

36:49 ↗ with

36:50 ↗ the

36:51 ↗ ideas that you would either go with

36:53 ↗ option one which is keep as presented in

36:55 ↗ the materials which requires no action

36:58 ↗ um but if there's a motion to make a

37:00 ↗ change and that's what the commission

37:03 ↗ would actually discuss and then vote on

37:06 ↗ for each of the amendments so to your

37:08 ↗ voice i hand it over to you for the

37:09 ↗ first item

37:11 ↗ which is uh just confirmation of the

37:13 ↗ meeting dates and time

37:16 ↗ all right

37:18 ↗ well

37:23 ↗ i believe for the

37:25 ↗ first one the meeting confirmation that

37:27 ↗ is our typical regular meetings at 6 30.

37:30 ↗ um

37:32 ↗ i guess it'd be city chambers

37:34 ↗ but currently virtual

37:38 ↗ and i believe we have two options so

37:40 ↗ option one is to keep that what we've

37:42 ↗ always known or option two is to change

37:49 ↗ is there any motion to change it

37:55 ↗ so this is where like i said i'm still

37:57 ↗ got a little bit of learning curve i

37:58 ↗ guess uh hearing none

38:00 ↗ we move along

38:02 ↗ i'm looking at you matt

38:04 ↗ that's not a good one

38:06 ↗ hearing none we move along exactly

38:10 ↗ okay appreciate it violence is consensus

38:13 ↗ island's okay okay

38:15 ↗ for the first amendment um it's to

38:18 ↗ determine kind of the length of public

38:20 ↗ comment this is something that's

38:21 ↗ presented at most of the boards and

38:23 ↗ commissions consider when they update

38:24 ↗ their rules and regulations and so the

38:25 ↗ first option that was presented in the

38:28 ↗ memo was consideration of keeping it the

38:29 ↗ same which is five minutes when we have

38:31 ↗ public comment

38:32 ↗ or consideration to changing the length

38:34 ↗ of public comment to three mid uh three

38:36 ↗ minutes

38:37 ↗ which is consistent with a change that

38:39 ↗ the transstate advisory board made for

38:41 ↗ their rules and regulations

38:44 ↗ and i'm happy to answer any questions on

38:46 ↗ these um sureflies

38:51 ↗ does anyone have any questions on

38:57 ↗ all right looks like we're gonna stick

38:58 ↗ with five minutes option one

39:00 ↗ hearing none

39:02 ↗ okay

39:03 ↗ moving on to

39:04 ↗ amendment two

39:06 ↗ so the second amendment is the move of

39:08 ↗ the public comment on the agenda

39:11 ↗ originally in our current

39:13 ↗ rules and regulations comment public

39:15 ↗ comment is actually identified at the

39:16 ↗ end of the agenda

39:18 ↗ um i think based on conversations we've

39:20 ↗ had with commissioners the preference is

39:22 ↗ to have public command at the beginning

39:23 ↗ so that is what's actually presented in

39:26 ↗ the

39:27 ↗ uh replacement rules that was presented

39:30 ↗ to the commission so

39:32 ↗ hand it over you to

39:34 ↗ to you

39:35 ↗ uh chair voice

39:38 ↗ all right so speaking to amendment two

39:39 ↗ the public comment on the agenda whether

39:41 ↗ it should be before the agenda

39:43 ↗ um

39:44 ↗ or at the end

39:46 ↗ does anyone have any questions

39:50 ↗ any motions

39:52 ↗ tara voice it looks like there's a

39:54 ↗ question from commissioner lewis

39:57 ↗ so

39:58 ↗ no problem at all my chat for some

40:00 ↗ reason isn't working because i don't

40:01 ↗ have everyone i just have host

40:04 ↗ and then the commissioners alone but i

40:06 ↗ can't i can't see anything in my chat

40:08 ↗ screen

40:11 ↗ so i can i can track the chat sure voice

40:13 ↗ okay

40:14 ↗ okay

40:17 ↗ please commissioner lewis

40:19 ↗ thank you chair voice um what i want to

40:21 ↗ clarify is because we actually had a

40:23 ↗ change of procedure recently uh so i

40:26 ↗ want to make sure what this does is this

40:28 ↗ actually just addresses a separate

40:30 ↗ um agenda item of public comment in

40:33 ↗ addition to public comments that we're

40:35 ↗ taking if we're obviously having a

40:37 ↗ public comment

40:39 ↗ for whatever our agenda items are so

40:41 ↗ this would actually be a double in a

40:43 ↗ meeting where we have public comment

40:45 ↗ there would actually be two spaces for

40:48 ↗ public comment is that correct stephen

40:50 ↗ uh no this is just so i i should clarify

40:54 ↗ from what was in the memo we identified

40:55 ↗ kind of the three different options of

40:58 ↗ having public comment at the beginning

40:59 ↗ have a public comment at the end or

41:00 ↗ having public comment after every topic

41:02 ↗ this is kind of addressing the first one

41:04 ↗ which is do we have public comment

41:07 ↗ identified on our agendas

41:09 ↗ at the beginning of the agendas uh

41:10 ↗ versus at the end and then the next

41:13 ↗ amendment is the discussion on do we

41:15 ↗ have it after every topic does that help

41:16 ↗ pennsylvania

41:18 ↗ that is my question thank you that's why

41:20 ↗ thank you for breaking that up into two

41:21 ↗ that's what i wanted to make sure we

41:22 ↗ were talking about

41:26 ↗ yeah and discussion with uh tisha city

41:28 ↗ clerk we

41:30 ↗ it made sense to split this up to make

41:32 ↗ it a cleaner discussion with further

41:33 ↗ commissioners

41:37 ↗ so this would be our typical general

41:39 ↗ public comment correct stephen

41:42 ↗ correct

41:46 ↗ so two options again before us for the

41:48 ↗ general public comment as far as where

41:50 ↗ it appears in our agenda

41:52 ↗ uh move to the beginning

41:55 ↗ or again

41:56 ↗ we can't change it um but that would

41:58 ↗ require emotion or action on

42:00 ↗ one of our commissioners behalf

42:06 ↗ hearing none

42:07 ↗ option one

42:11 ↗ okay moving on to the next amendment

42:13 ↗ this is to allow additional public

42:15 ↗ comment with every topic in public

42:16 ↗ hearings and so similar to the other

42:19 ↗ amendments if the first option is

42:22 ↗ requires no action that's not to add the

42:24 ↗ edit or the second option requires a

42:26 ↗ motion and that is to add the edit to

42:28 ↗ put it into our rules and regulations to

42:31 ↗ identify public comment with each topic

42:34 ↗ discussion in public hearings

42:43 ↗ stephen this is tisha can i make a

42:45 ↗ clarification here

42:47 ↗ yes please

42:49 ↗ so i um as i understand it this would

42:53 ↗ so your your public hearings or public

42:56 ↗ comment is a required element of your

42:57 ↗ public hearings

42:59 ↗ as as implied in the title so that's

43:02 ↗ that's not going anywhere you're always

43:04 ↗ going to be taking public comment at

43:05 ↗ your public hearings but um i think that

43:08 ↗ what we wanted to talk to you about here

43:09 ↗ was um what i believe has become a bit

43:12 ↗ of a practice to take public comment

43:15 ↗ after each agenda item

43:17 ↗ irregardless of whether it's a public

43:19 ↗ hearing

43:20 ↗ um and so

43:21 ↗ that is not currently in the ppc's rules

43:24 ↗ of procedure nor is it being indicated

43:26 ↗ on your agendas currently that there's

43:28 ↗ interspersed public comment

43:30 ↗ opportunities so this is an opportunity

43:32 ↗ tonight to sort of clarify um

43:36 ↗ where and how that public comment is

43:38 ↗ going to occur so that your rules your

43:40 ↗ agenda and what's happening at the

43:41 ↗ meeting is all consistent um for at

43:44 ↗ every meeting

43:45 ↗ so um that's what we wanted to bring

43:47 ↗ forward to tonight you know i know

43:49 ↗ steven and i do have some thoughts about

43:51 ↗ the

43:52 ↗ the public public comment occurring

43:55 ↗ after each agenda item there's sort of

43:57 ↗ some operational considerations there um

44:00 ↗ given that we have limited time with uh

44:02 ↗ with you to um

44:05 ↗ uh provide input on your work plan items

44:07 ↗ and make recommendations um the

44:09 ↗ interspersing of public comment can can

44:12 ↗ be challenging to facilitate for the

44:14 ↗ chair for the staff

44:16 ↗ um

44:16 ↗ i i'd also just like to mention that you

44:19 ↗ know as we talked about earlier tonight

44:22 ↗ we will be

44:23 ↗ providing an ongoing opportunity for

44:25 ↗ members of the public to participate

44:26 ↗ virtually in your meetings and make

44:28 ↗ comments virtually um which i i'm really

44:30 ↗ excited about that opportunity um but

44:33 ↗ providing those

44:34 ↗ frequent public comment opportunities

44:37 ↗ throughout the meeting does become more

44:38 ↗ challenging when we're managing both

44:40 ↗ people who might be in the room and

44:41 ↗ monitoring people who might be attending

44:44 ↗ virtually so just wanted to share a

44:46 ↗ little bit of input there and provide a

44:47 ↗ little more context and look forward to

44:49 ↗ hearing your discussion

44:56 ↗ great thank you tisha

45:07 ↗ okay

45:09 ↗ would anyone like to comment about

45:12 ↗ um allowing additional public comments

45:14 ↗ with every topic in public hearings

45:19 ↗ commissioner lewis

45:22 ↗ thank you chair boyce i i i really

45:25 ↗ appreciate

45:26 ↗ the opportunity to be able to discuss

45:28 ↗ this tonight because i think it's pretty

45:29 ↗ fundamental to how we

45:31 ↗ how we run our agendas and how we engage

45:32 ↗ with the public which in my opinion is

45:34 ↗ one of the most vital things that we do

45:37 ↗ second only to advising the council is

45:40 ↗ being able to give a space for the

45:42 ↗ public to be able to come

45:43 ↗ when we have really elaborate agendas i

45:46 ↗ can recognize that it can get very

45:48 ↗ onerous but it's also i think very

45:50 ↗ difficult for members of the public to

45:51 ↗ prepare comments on these large packets

45:54 ↗ and feel that they need to present

45:56 ↗ everything they want to say in a

45:57 ↗ compressed time period and it's been

45:59 ↗ hugely beneficial especially when we do

46:02 ↗ our work on title 18

46:04 ↗ to be able to have these opportunities

46:05 ↗ for a pause and break and be able to

46:07 ↗ break these things up i also think it is

46:09 ↗ very important that we actually put it

46:11 ↗ into our rules and regulations

46:13 ↗ so i'll be very interested to see how

46:14 ↗ everyone else feels but i think that

46:16 ↗ having more venues for the public to be

46:18 ↗ able to comment on the work we do is is

46:20 ↗ very important so i'm a proponent of

46:22 ↗ that and would love to hear what you

46:24 ↗ guys say

46:29 ↗ thank you commissioner uh commissioner

46:31 ↗ milligan

46:33 ↗ hi and i really only have one i think i

46:35 ↗ was um adding my thing because i was

46:39 ↗ trying to get all panelists thank you uh

46:41 ↗ commissioner nina milligan here thanks

46:43 ↗ chair boys

46:44 ↗ i have a couple questions one

46:48 ↗ i'll just bundle them up a little bit

46:49 ↗ one is the word

46:51 ↗ allow

46:53 ↗ so when it says allow additional public

46:56 ↗ comment with every public hearing that

46:58 ↗ speaks to me differently than require

47:02 ↗ the public hearing to be open

47:04 ↗ with every topic

47:06 ↗ and

47:08 ↗ and then i want to understand more

47:11 ↗ clearly

47:12 ↗ if we do nothing no amendment here then

47:15 ↗ we are going with the opportunity for

47:17 ↗ the public to speak

47:19 ↗ after every topic

47:23 ↗ the other question has to do with when

47:26 ↗ the agenda is written and how a topic is

47:29 ↗ identified sometimes when um we've had

47:32 ↗ topics come to us

47:34 ↗ the agenda has one big um

47:38 ↗ title and then there are sub titles

47:41 ↗ underneath it so at what time is it

47:43 ↗ determined that it is a

47:46 ↗ topic

47:47 ↗ that's broken up

47:50 ↗ and just

47:51 ↗ for curiosity now and and when does that

47:53 ↗ decision get made who makes that

47:55 ↗ decision so the first thing is the

47:56 ↗ difference between allow and require and

47:59 ↗ the other is what defines a topic

48:02 ↗ and generally speaking i'm agreeing with

48:03 ↗ um chair lewis i i like each topic being

48:06 ↗ broken out it helps us in our

48:08 ↗ deliberations and it helps to control

48:10 ↗ and manage the complexity of the topics

48:12 ↗ for the public so i'm in favor but i

48:15 ↗ just want to hear these

48:21 ↗ care voice you manage if i respond um

48:23 ↗ with questions no please please go ahead

48:27 ↗ and and then i'll i'll

48:30 ↗ first respond and then tisha if if i'm

48:32 ↗ missing anything please add on um so the

48:34 ↗ the difference between uh allow and

48:36 ↗ require is is

48:37 ↗ staff kind of see it the same the intent

48:40 ↗ of this is we need to put it into our

48:42 ↗ rules and regulations if that's what we

48:44 ↗ want to have as part of our agendas

48:46 ↗ um that they require

48:49 ↗ uh makes the assumption that someone

48:51 ↗ wants to speak up for public comments so

48:53 ↗ it's it's hard

48:55 ↗ to staff there's no difference between

48:57 ↗ two the main thing is we want whatever

48:59 ↗ the commission wants you want to

49:01 ↗ recognize that in the rules and

49:02 ↗ regulations

49:04 ↗ for your second question on decision on

49:06 ↗ agendas

49:07 ↗ um

49:08 ↗ staff make a recommendation based on

49:10 ↗ the topics that are being brought on the

49:12 ↗ agendas and we discussed that typically

49:14 ↗ with

49:15 ↗ the commission chairs

49:17 ↗ to look at if

49:19 ↗ it makes sense to bundle certain topics

49:21 ↗ based on what type of policy questions

49:22 ↗ we might have for the commissioners as

49:24 ↗ well as the context of the topics as

49:26 ↗ well as if if it's really heavy then we

49:29 ↗ really and and requires a lot of

49:32 ↗ explanation and detail then we probably

49:34 ↗ don't want to bundle that with something

49:35 ↗ else and separate it out but if there

49:38 ↗ isn't a lot of policy question on a

49:40 ↗ particular topic that we're bringing to

49:41 ↗ the commission

49:42 ↗ and there we don't expect a huge

49:45 ↗ discussion on it then that's where the

49:47 ↗ staff will make the recommendation that

49:48 ↗ okay maybe maybe we can bundle these

49:50 ↗ items together um as it makes sense to

49:53 ↗ kind of talk about them especially if

49:54 ↗ there's overlap in the type of topics

49:56 ↗ that we're bringing to the commission as

49:57 ↗ well

50:03 ↗ thank you stephen um did i miss anything

50:06 ↗ uh you did a great job stephen the only

50:09 ↗ thing i'd clarify

50:11 ↗ commissioner milligan is that current

50:12 ↗ the current

50:14 ↗ uh replacement rules do not provide for

50:18 ↗ this um public comment after each

50:21 ↗ agenda item so that would be an

50:24 ↗ amendment that the commissioners could

50:26 ↗ make to

50:28 ↗ to add that and so i'm sorry if that

50:30 ↗ didn't come through as i'm looking at

50:32 ↗ the slide

50:33 ↗ it doesn't appear to have come through

50:35 ↗ so stephen correct me if i'm wrong but i

50:37 ↗ did not see that provision for public

50:40 ↗ comment after each item in the

50:42 ↗ replacement rules

50:44 ↗ that's correct what was presented in the

50:46 ↗ commission's materials doesn't doesn't

50:48 ↗ reflect this so this would need to be an

50:50 ↗ amendment to

50:52 ↗ that yeah and i would i double down on

50:55 ↗ what stephen said um

50:57 ↗ while on the allow versus require we

51:00 ↗ really are looking for consistency so

51:02 ↗ where i think it would be advisable to

51:05 ↗ to put a little discretion in there but

51:07 ↗ we the expectation is if the commission

51:09 ↗ wanted that comment after each agenda

51:12 ↗ item that we would aim to do that for

51:14 ↗ for each agenda item and um

51:17 ↗ uh

51:18 ↗ just for consistency purposes

51:30 ↗ chair voice you're muted

51:34 ↗ thank you stephen thank you tisha uh

51:36 ↗ vice chair monahan

51:38 ↗ yeah hey matt monahan here uh

51:41 ↗ my vote would be to keep the things as

51:43 ↗ they are in the rules today which is

51:45 ↗ have one

51:46 ↗ public hearing for all items um at the

51:49 ↗ end of the various fault questions that

51:52 ↗ we might add um the reason why i like

51:54 ↗ just having one

51:56 ↗ i i hear staff on just operationally

51:58 ↗ it's gonna get really difficult when we

51:59 ↗ have multiple different ways for the

52:01 ↗ public to participate

52:03 ↗ and that's a good thing obviously but if

52:05 ↗ we have to do that multiple we're

52:06 ↗ already doing it you know at least twice

52:08 ↗ in these meetings right with general

52:09 ↗ public comment and then public comment

52:11 ↗ on the public hearing if we were to do

52:13 ↗ that multiple times i just can only

52:14 ↗ imagine kind of the

52:16 ↗ some of the operational issues that are

52:18 ↗ going to come up and people are going to

52:19 ↗ be cut off when they didn't we didn't

52:21 ↗ mean to and i don't want that so i'd

52:23 ↗ like to just try to land that plane

52:24 ↗ twice and not three four five times i

52:27 ↗ also like the idea of being consistent i

52:29 ↗ understand the development commission

52:30 ↗ might do things a little bit differently

52:32 ↗ but if we can fall back into line with

52:34 ↗ the vast majority of the other boards

52:36 ↗ and with the way city council does it

52:38 ↗ that just isn't much cleaner um and then

52:41 ↗ you know on the legal piece so the

52:42 ↗ procedural due process having brought a

52:44 ↗ case like this i would make a meal out

52:46 ↗ of the fact that a commission was doing

52:48 ↗ something different than other

52:49 ↗ commissions um

52:50 ↗ it just doesn't look good for anybody

52:53 ↗ and so i'm

52:55 ↗ i'm fairly

52:57 ↗ strong in my beliefs that we should go

52:59 ↗ we should although i recognize why we

53:01 ↗ did it for title 18 and it sort of made

53:04 ↗ sense i think now it's time to go back

53:05 ↗ to first principles and have you know

53:07 ↗ one general public comment at the

53:09 ↗ beginning of the meeting and then a you

53:11 ↗ know public comment on the public

53:12 ↗ hearing um once in a meeting and give

53:15 ↗ the public an opportunity to participate

53:17 ↗ at that time

53:18 ↗ thank you

53:23 ↗ thank you commissioner monahan uh

53:25 ↗ commissioner bader

53:27 ↗ yeah hi says sarah bader um

53:29 ↗ i want to preface my comment by saying

53:32 ↗ that this isn't to like discount the

53:33 ↗ value of the public comment because i

53:34 ↗ find them speaking after every topic

53:37 ↗ really helpful but i think in practice

53:39 ↗ what we have seen happen is that

53:41 ↗ especially when it gets to you know 9 30

53:43 ↗ at night and we're kind of past the end

53:45 ↗ and everybody's tired that there have

53:47 ↗ been times where

53:48 ↗ someone's wanted to make a comment and

53:49 ↗ they've been like just read my letter um

53:51 ↗ you know because there's a pressure um

53:53 ↗ at that point to not you know to kind of

53:55 ↗ get this over with um so i actually

53:57 ↗ think it's been detrimental in some

53:59 ↗ instances to um public who have been

54:01 ↗ there um when they have to wait until

54:03 ↗ that topic is presented and so for

54:05 ↗ for that reason um i think the the kind

54:08 ↗ of

54:09 ↗ one bucket in addition to the general

54:10 ↗ public comment bucket might be the the

54:12 ↗ way to go

54:17 ↗ thank you commissioner bader

54:19 ↗ commissioner milligan

54:26 ↗ thank you commissioner 90 milligan here

54:28 ↗ and thank you commissioner monahan uh

54:31 ↗ you've bent my ear to the legal side i

54:33 ↗ um

54:36 ↗ uh appreciate the um consideration that

54:38 ↗ you brought

54:39 ↗ uh and agree with you on a plus one but

54:42 ↗ i also want to expand it a little bit

54:44 ↗ and it goes back to my uh earlier

54:46 ↗ comment about defining

54:48 ↗ uh what the topic is and i think that

54:51 ↗ this needs to also

54:54 ↗ and and tisha can and explain this a

54:57 ↗ little further it needs to relate to the

54:59 ↗ notice of the public hearing

55:01 ↗ that goes out to the public to say we're

55:04 ↗ having a public hearing it's on this

55:06 ↗ topic

55:07 ↗ and

55:08 ↗ per topic

55:10 ↗ we will have

55:12 ↗ a public hearing

55:14 ↗ now in in any meeting

55:16 ↗ you're right title 18 has been odd

55:18 ↗ because

55:20 ↗ we've made buckets but usually we'll

55:22 ↗ have a topic

55:24 ↗ and we could have more than one public

55:26 ↗ hearing in an evening depending on the

55:28 ↗ notice

55:29 ↗ of the topic

55:31 ↗ that leads us to hold public hearing so

55:34 ↗ i'm um i'm thinking that

55:36 ↗ if if i'm correct so let me know if i'm

55:38 ↗ correct and then the other is thank you

55:40 ↗ commissioner monahan and leaning towards

55:42 ↗ the original option depend and it

55:44 ↗ depends on a careful uh distinction of

55:47 ↗ what a topic is

55:53 ↗ thank you commissioner milligan uh

55:56 ↗ commissioner lewis

55:59 ↗ thank you chair boyce um i appreciate uh

56:03 ↗ matt's comments and i also appreciate

56:05 ↗ that uh the city clerk and our city

56:08 ↗ staff have looked over and presented us

56:09 ↗ with these options knowing that we they

56:11 ↗ are in line and that we're not crossing

56:13 ↗ any legal boundary right now uh since we

56:15 ↗ have a great support staff to be able to

56:17 ↗ give us these options i uh

56:20 ↗ i do think that it's uh important that

56:22 ↗ the

56:23 ↗ the

56:24 ↗ the public know when they can comment

56:26 ↗ and so again to nina's point of being

56:28 ↗ able to use that word allow it's not a

56:30 ↗ requirement to be able to have in our

56:32 ↗ agenda meetings that people know when

56:34 ↗ they do have an opportunity to speak to

56:35 ↗ kind of cut down confusion is important

56:38 ↗ so what i'm going to do right now is i'm

56:39 ↗ going to make a motion

56:41 ↗ uh for an amendment for option two

56:44 ↗ as presented to us

56:48 ↗ and see if uh

56:50 ↗ if i have a second

56:52 ↗ do we have a second

57:06 ↗ all right hearing

57:08 ↗ um there we go we got one in the chat uh

57:11 ↗ nina

57:13 ↗ i'm gonna second the um motion because

57:16 ↗ then

57:17 ↗ we're still

57:19 ↗ discussing before we vote

57:22 ↗ i want a lot of discussion on um

57:24 ↗ commissioner lewis's motion

57:28 ↗ yep

57:29 ↗ all right so now that we have a motion

57:31 ↗ and has been second we can have a

57:33 ↗ discussion so we can open this back up

57:35 ↗ with staff and then we can take a final

57:37 ↗ vote and see what it exactly um

57:40 ↗ we're putting into this

57:42 ↗ this particular amendment

57:46 ↗ so again learning curve with me so

57:49 ↗ phoning a friend out there somebody

57:52 ↗ where are we going with this stephen are

57:53 ↗ you going to present anything more on

57:55 ↗ this topic

57:57 ↗ your voice i think i'd like to just kind

57:58 ↗ of clarify on

58:00 ↗ what was presented for so specific to

58:02 ↗ what's on the screen

58:04 ↗ um specific to public hearings and going

58:08 ↗ to commissioner milligan's uh

58:10 ↗ comment question

58:12 ↗ in terms of trying to determine

58:15 ↗ what was you know trying to clarify what

58:17 ↗ was actually the edit going to be this

58:20 ↗ was specific to the public hearings and

58:22 ↗ so

58:23 ↗ the

58:24 ↗ amendment would be to put into our

58:27 ↗ public hearings

58:28 ↗ splitting up the topics as recommended

58:31 ↗ by staff and working with the chairs

58:34 ↗ and then allowing multiple public

58:36 ↗ comments as part of the public hearing

58:38 ↗ what's in the presented materials

58:41 ↗ provided to the commission tonight

58:43 ↗ is that we would consolidate those

58:45 ↗ topics and not split them up

58:48 ↗ and then have public clarifying

58:50 ↗ questions

58:51 ↗ and then have

58:53 ↗ consolidated public comments on all of

58:55 ↗ it and then commission would have their

58:56 ↗ deliberation that's that's what's listed

58:59 ↗ in terms of order of items

59:01 ↗ uh for public hearings does that

59:04 ↗ commissioner milligan does that clarify

59:06 ↗ your comment question

59:11 ↗ um if i may and i put q may i chair

59:14 ↗ voice

59:15 ↗ commissioner milligan here thank you um

59:18 ↗ so when i'm here let's let's talk about

59:21 ↗ a couple examples that might be helpful

59:23 ↗ here because we have been so long in

59:25 ↗ title 18. let's say we're going forward

59:26 ↗ and we have a um

59:29 ↗ a public hearing on a rezoning

59:33 ↗ and we have a public hearing on uh

59:35 ↗ something else please help me some you

59:37 ↗ know some other thing a change in the

59:38 ↗ comp plan

59:40 ↗ i don't know

59:41 ↗ let's say that let's say those so

59:43 ↗ those would be

59:45 ↗ two different topics

59:47 ↗ in the agenda and there's nothing that

59:50 ↗ would conflate them

59:51 ↗ they would remain two different topics

59:53 ↗ and we'd have a public hearing on one

59:55 ↗ and we'd have a public hearing on the

59:57 ↗ other

1:00:00 ↗ correct that is the way that it would be

1:00:02 ↗ if we do not amend

1:00:05 ↗ right okay

1:00:06 ↗ then if the

1:00:08 ↗ um

1:00:09 ↗ uh the

1:00:12 ↗ the change to the comp plan

1:00:15 ↗ topic had a lot of sub categories in it

1:00:20 ↗ if we leave it the way it is everybody'd

1:00:22 ↗ have to speak to the subcategories at

1:00:23 ↗ one time in the public hearing

1:00:26 ↗ but one would hope that back in the

1:00:28 ↗ docket or wherever it is that these

1:00:29 ↗ things get decided that these topics are

1:00:32 ↗ clear

1:00:33 ↗ and not

1:00:34 ↗ uh a complicated a

1:00:36 ↗ bunch of separate real topics i think

1:00:39 ↗ you know we're talking about this here

1:00:40 ↗ year i'm asserting the point that having

1:00:44 ↗ one public hearing per topic is the way

1:00:46 ↗ to go

1:00:46 ↗ but i think it is very dependent on how

1:00:49 ↗ the topics are

1:00:51 ↗ developed

1:00:52 ↗ because i do want the public to be able

1:00:55 ↗ to contribute in a meaningful way on a

1:00:58 ↗ package of information that is

1:00:59 ↗ digestible by by all of us

1:01:02 ↗ so that's um if you have further things

1:01:03 ↗ to say about that be nice thank you

1:01:08 ↗ i think commissioner milligan you you

1:01:10 ↗ clarified it exactly how how it would be

1:01:12 ↗ in terms of like how it's presented

1:01:13 ↗ right now um if it's a separate public

1:01:16 ↗ hearing there would be a separate public

1:01:17 ↗ comment for that public hearing if even

1:01:20 ↗ if it's a complex topic but it's one

1:01:21 ↗ public hearing there's still only one

1:01:23 ↗ public comment allowed for that and

1:01:26 ↗ that's that's kind of how it's spelled

1:01:28 ↗ out in the presented

1:01:31 ↗ replacement rules

1:01:36 ↗ if i may jump in commissioner voice so

1:01:39 ↗ basically again this is this is going to

1:01:40 ↗ also come down to myself and

1:01:43 ↗ and vice chair monahan and staff working

1:01:45 ↗ to

1:01:46 ↗ consolidate these topics

1:01:48 ↗ uh

1:01:49 ↗ to be able to present so it'll fall upon

1:01:51 ↗ us to be able to give and provide

1:01:54 ↗ staff with enough

1:01:55 ↗ where we think we can find

1:01:57 ↗ topics that meld together and then say

1:01:59 ↗ we want to put this out from a public

1:02:01 ↗ hearing or you know staff will obviously

1:02:03 ↗ come to us and then like you just

1:02:05 ↗ mentioned that would get one hearing in

1:02:07 ↗ itself one opportunity to comment

1:02:09 ↗ doesn't mean if we have a slow night we

1:02:11 ↗ can have two different public hearings

1:02:13 ↗ but we wouldn't go through sub-topic

1:02:14 ↗ sub-topic sub-topic and continually just

1:02:17 ↗ let common common comment

1:02:19 ↗ which i think is part of the gripe at

1:02:21 ↗ least for myself

1:02:22 ↗ is that

1:02:24 ↗ sound about basically what commissioner

1:02:25 ↗ milligan said a lot more elegantly than

1:02:27 ↗ i did

1:02:39 ↗ yes

1:02:40 ↗ chair voice yes so

1:02:42 ↗ um

1:02:43 ↗ yes

1:02:44 ↗ to to kind of reiterate what your voice

1:02:46 ↗ was saying the intention for staff is to

1:02:49 ↗ try to make

1:02:50 ↗ any of these topics and public hearings

1:02:51 ↗ as simple as possible in terms of

1:02:53 ↗ consolidation we don't i mean it's not

1:02:55 ↗ beneficial to you and not beneficial to

1:02:57 ↗ us

1:02:58 ↗ to bring such a complex topic that it's

1:03:00 ↗ difficult for us to discuss in a public

1:03:02 ↗ hearing and so to be able to split that

1:03:05 ↗ up as much as we're able to

1:03:07 ↗ we we work as much as we can with the

1:03:09 ↗ chairs to make that work

1:03:13 ↗ thank you stephen tisha

1:03:15 ↗ chair with your permission i you know we

1:03:17 ↗ have we have a land use expert with us

1:03:20 ↗ tonight um anne-marie soto i i was

1:03:22 ↗ wondering if she might have any thoughts

1:03:24 ↗ on um this the concept of separating

1:03:27 ↗ these public

1:03:28 ↗ hearings into topics there's there's

1:03:31 ↗ discretion that's required in that and

1:03:34 ↗ based on some of the material material

1:03:36 ↗ she presented earlier tonight i'm just

1:03:38 ↗ anne marie

1:03:40 ↗ uh

1:03:40 ↗ might you have any

1:03:43 ↗ thoughts with again with the chairs

1:03:45 ↗ willingness

1:03:47 ↗ please say marie

1:03:49 ↗ more information the better

1:03:51 ↗ yeah so you have some flexibility in the

1:03:54 ↗ way you do it

1:03:55 ↗ um if the commission wants to allow to

1:04:00 ↗ separate topics then you can certainly

1:04:02 ↗ do that um but ultimately you are merely

1:04:06 ↗ required by law to have

1:04:09 ↗ a public hearing on the overall

1:04:12 ↗ item

1:04:13 ↗ if you want to separate it out because

1:04:16 ↗ it might be confusing or because you

1:04:19 ↗ want to get

1:04:21 ↗ more into the nitty-gritty of a

1:04:23 ↗ particular topic you can certainly do

1:04:26 ↗ that

1:04:27 ↗ that is something that you don't

1:04:29 ↗ necessarily need to decide by

1:04:33 ↗ putting it in your rules of procedure as

1:04:36 ↗ we talked about before you can also have

1:04:39 ↗ some you have some flexibility where if

1:04:41 ↗ there are special special circumstances

1:04:43 ↗ you could announce that for this

1:04:46 ↗ particular public hearing we're going to

1:04:49 ↗ take a testimony on these specific

1:04:52 ↗ topics separate from the overall

1:04:55 ↗ uh the overall topic so when we're

1:04:58 ↗ dealing with for example all of these

1:05:00 ↗ buckets for the title 18 update you know

1:05:03 ↗ you have the you know bucket number four

1:05:06 ↗ but within bucket number four there

1:05:08 ↗ might be you know three or four distinct

1:05:11 ↗ topics within that bucket so you could

1:05:14 ↗ say

1:05:15 ↗ we're just going to have a public

1:05:16 ↗ hearing on bucket number four and pretty

1:05:19 ↗ much anything that's within those

1:05:21 ↗ buckets is

1:05:23 ↗ available for the public to comment on

1:05:25 ↗ or you can say we're going to have a

1:05:28 ↗ public hearing on bucket number four but

1:05:31 ↗ specifically we'll take testimony on

1:05:34 ↗ these specific items

1:05:36 ↗ separately so that you can have a little

1:05:39 ↗ bit more focused discussion on those

1:05:42 ↗ you don't need to decide that

1:05:44 ↗ necessarily by putting it in your rules

1:05:46 ↗ though you can decide that prior to a

1:05:49 ↗ particular public hearing that's the way

1:05:51 ↗ you might want to do it for that

1:05:53 ↗ that um that item

1:05:55 ↗ so that you have a little bit of

1:05:57 ↗ flexibility you just want to make sure

1:05:59 ↗ if that's what you're going to do and

1:06:01 ↗ it's not in your rules of procedure that

1:06:03 ↗ you are communicating that to the public

1:06:06 ↗ in advance of the public hearing so that

1:06:08 ↗ they understand how you're going to be

1:06:11 ↗ taking testimony and then at the outset

1:06:13 ↗ of the public hearing that particular

1:06:16 ↗ evening you would want to again explain

1:06:19 ↗ this is the way we're going to be taking

1:06:21 ↗ public testimony tonight you know we

1:06:24 ↗ we're separating it out into these

1:06:25 ↗ separate topics

1:06:27 ↗ if you have a general comment however

1:06:29 ↗ that doesn't neatly fit into those

1:06:31 ↗ topics you would still want to make sure

1:06:33 ↗ that it's if it's covered under the

1:06:35 ↗ overall umbrella that you're still

1:06:37 ↗ taking top uh comment on that item

1:06:43 ↗ thank you emory yeah that was very

1:06:45 ↗ helpful um you might want to stick

1:06:46 ↗ around because commissioner

1:06:49 ↗ uh vice chair monahan has a question i

1:06:51 ↗ don't know who it's directed towards

1:06:52 ↗ yeah sorry this is going to be directed

1:06:54 ↗ towards anne-marie um so clarifying

1:06:57 ↗ question okay let's say there's one

1:06:58 ↗ overarching topic bucket four and within

1:07:00 ↗ bucket four we have subtopics a b c and

1:07:02 ↗ d and we say we're going to take public

1:07:05 ↗ hearing on a b c and d

1:07:07 ↗ do we then at the end of d

1:07:09 ↗ have to have a public hearing or bucket

1:07:12 ↗ four writ large or can we rely just on

1:07:15 ↗ the public comment for subtopics a b c d

1:07:19 ↗ that makes sense

1:07:20 ↗ depend on how granular you're getting

1:07:23 ↗ with those buckets so if your buckets

1:07:27 ↗ are so specific that it doesn't cover

1:07:30 ↗ everything that's in

1:07:32 ↗ you know the overall

1:07:34 ↗ bucket number four um you wouldn't want

1:07:36 ↗ to be precluding the public from being

1:07:39 ↗ able to talk about something that might

1:07:41 ↗ not neatly fit into those

1:07:43 ↗ buckets so

1:07:45 ↗ i mean it can get a little confusing

1:07:47 ↗ when you're doing it that way because

1:07:49 ↗ you want to make sure that if

1:07:52 ↗ if here's the topic here's the overall

1:07:54 ↗ topic

1:07:55 ↗ and you've got you know this little neat

1:07:58 ↗ part this little neat part but something

1:08:00 ↗ doesn't quite fit within you know one of

1:08:03 ↗ those sub parts what are you how are you

1:08:06 ↗ going to make sure that the public still

1:08:07 ↗ gets an opportunity to comment on it

1:08:11 ↗ right yeah i

1:08:12 ↗ could get even more confusing you know

1:08:14 ↗ we say we're only going to talk about

1:08:15 ↗ the even number pages well i want to

1:08:16 ↗ talk about the odd number pages so yeah

1:08:18 ↗ i i get it um

1:08:21 ↗ all of this just leads me

1:08:22 ↗ to further underscore my my my position

1:08:25 ↗ that having just one

1:08:27 ↗ with the flexibility that look if

1:08:29 ↗ everybody at the meeting thinks hey

1:08:30 ↗ breaking this up for this one meeting

1:08:32 ↗ and we can publicly announce it

1:08:35 ↗ that's fine but

1:08:36 ↗ yeah i just i get nervous

1:08:38 ↗ particularly like some members of the

1:08:39 ↗ public don't necessarily want to confine

1:08:42 ↗ you know

1:08:43 ↗ if they have a comment on on you know

1:08:45 ↗ topic d they don't want to sit through

1:08:46 ↗ topics a through c

1:08:48 ↗ um and then only be able to comment on

1:08:50 ↗ topic d right they want to be able to

1:08:52 ↗ say it you know

1:08:53 ↗ as part of their overarching comment so

1:08:55 ↗ thank you for the clarifying question i

1:08:56 ↗ appreciate it

1:09:01 ↗ thank you vice chairman and thank you

1:09:03 ↗ all of you for your wonderful comments

1:09:05 ↗ um

1:09:07 ↗ i kind of saved my mind from my own i'm

1:09:09 ↗ kind of an agreement with vice chair

1:09:10 ↗ monahan and commissioner bader

1:09:13 ↗ um i i think like i said we need to try

1:09:16 ↗ and rule in a little bit i understand

1:09:17 ↗ what we tried to do with title 18 i like

1:09:20 ↗ the idea of being able to have

1:09:22 ↗ one public hearing

1:09:24 ↗ and then having the flexibility with

1:09:26 ↗ proper notice where we can

1:09:28 ↗ discuss maybe myself and

1:09:30 ↗ vice chair monahan and even reach out to

1:09:32 ↗ other commissioners where they think hey

1:09:34 ↗ this is an area we need to break up and

1:09:35 ↗ ask for additional testimony so i think

1:09:37 ↗ we get the flexibility that we want with

1:09:39 ↗ also having a cleaner more efficient

1:09:43 ↗ meeting process

1:09:45 ↗ so that's where i'm leaning

1:09:50 ↗ commissioner lewis

1:09:53 ↗ thank you chair boys commissioner joy

1:09:55 ↗ lewis actually i put comment but it's

1:09:56 ↗ kind of more of a question steven

1:09:58 ↗ uh right now we're

1:10:00 ↗ proposing to be able to put it into

1:10:02 ↗ our rules and regulations in the agenda

1:10:05 ↗ of how we run things but what i'm

1:10:06 ↗ wondering is if instead we could put a

1:10:09 ↗ line in in section seven because i think

1:10:12 ↗ really what the intent is to allow for

1:10:15 ↗ there to be discretion to staff and to

1:10:17 ↗ the chair to be able to have this

1:10:19 ↗ flexibility so would we instead be able

1:10:22 ↗ to add it as a line item in the way that

1:10:24 ↗ we talk about

1:10:25 ↗ how the responsibilities of the chair to

1:10:27 ↗ to work with staff are we able to then

1:10:29 ↗ instead just use a line item that talks

1:10:31 ↗ about having a discretion to be able to

1:10:33 ↗ add additional points and just be able

1:10:35 ↗ to give that flexibility without

1:10:37 ↗ necessarily building it into our agenda

1:10:39 ↗ every single time so that we kind of hit

1:10:42 ↗ the um

1:10:43 ↗ the intent of how ppc has been running

1:10:46 ↗ rather than necessarily codifying it

1:10:48 ↗ right into our agenda meeting minutes is

1:10:50 ↗ that an option that we can do

1:10:53 ↗ uh commissioner lucy actually bring up a

1:10:55 ↗ good point uh there is actually already

1:10:57 ↗ a line item under the

1:10:59 ↗ public participation section for section

1:11:02 ↗ 7 that gives the chair the discretion

1:11:04 ↗ for public comment

1:11:10 ↗ so then i'll follow up so is there any

1:11:12 ↗ reason that staff doesn't feel that how

1:11:13 ↗ we've been operating historically is in

1:11:16 ↗ contrast to how this is i guess that's

1:11:18 ↗ what i was getting is that staff was

1:11:19 ↗ saying hey we want to we want to give

1:11:21 ↗ more clarity to that right and so being

1:11:24 ↗ able to then put it into our agenda

1:11:25 ↗ topics when we present them to the

1:11:28 ↗ public and we give notice of our

1:11:29 ↗ meetings i think we're all in agreement

1:11:30 ↗ about but what i'm trying to question is

1:11:33 ↗ if we're able to just put it in section

1:11:34 ↗ seven

1:11:35 ↗ and if we think that language is already

1:11:37 ↗ sufficient then we really don't need to

1:11:39 ↗ carry forward with emotion but again

1:11:41 ↗ that would be staff saying hey we do or

1:11:43 ↗ don't think that your rules and

1:11:44 ↗ regulations adhere to how you've been

1:11:46 ↗ operating

1:11:50 ↗ to respond i'm gonna phone a colleague

1:11:53 ↗ tisha

1:11:56 ↗ sure i'll offer some input anne-marie

1:11:57 ↗ please feel free to and add your

1:12:00 ↗ thoughts too my my thought is it would

1:12:02 ↗ be nice to have a statement in the rules

1:12:05 ↗ explaining that that might be an option

1:12:07 ↗ the commission chooses and maybe

1:12:09 ↗ establishing how that would be decided

1:12:12 ↗ um

1:12:12 ↗ i think

1:12:14 ↗ i i just tend to think the the more

1:12:16 ↗ transparent we can be in the less

1:12:18 ↗ discretion about what's done is

1:12:21 ↗ is uh welcome and that was really one of

1:12:23 ↗ the points of bringing these rules to

1:12:25 ↗ you is that they provide a lot more

1:12:27 ↗ clarity and specificity in a number of

1:12:29 ↗ situations so i think that that um while

1:12:33 ↗ i don't think it's necessarily precluded

1:12:35 ↗ from your rules i think adding a

1:12:37 ↗ statement saying that and whether it be

1:12:39 ↗ at the chair's discretion or

1:12:41 ↗ a majority of the commission at the

1:12:44 ↗ outset of the public hearing agrees

1:12:48 ↗ to

1:12:49 ↗ break the public hearing uh

1:12:51 ↗ comments into topic areas or

1:12:54 ↗ just maintain flexibility in how the

1:12:56 ↗ public comment is taken would be a good

1:12:58 ↗ idea

1:13:11 ↗ are there any more comments or questions

1:13:17 ↗ so uh stephen could you put the

1:13:20 ↗ that last slide up

1:13:21 ↗ please

1:13:29 ↗ can you see it's like

1:13:31 ↗ yes okay

1:13:35 ↗ so we have option one which is i believe

1:13:37 ↗ that is going to be

1:13:39 ↗ basically what we've discussed

1:13:41 ↗ and then option two which would require

1:13:43 ↗ a motion for any type of amendment to

1:13:46 ↗ amendment three

1:13:48 ↗ well chair we have a motion that's been

1:13:50 ↗ seconded at this point on option two

1:13:55 ↗ option two uh

1:13:58 ↗ by commissioner lewis am i getting that

1:14:00 ↗ right

1:14:03 ↗ okay

1:14:04 ↗ so i've got uh

1:14:06 ↗ commissioner lewis for comment like i

1:14:08 ↗ said you guys are gonna have to forgive

1:14:09 ↗ me this is not my expertise

1:14:11 ↗ a little bit of a learning curve so am i

1:14:13 ↗ allowed to actually ask for comment even

1:14:14 ↗ though there's a motion on the floor or

1:14:16 ↗ does this have to be decided

1:14:19 ↗ okay uh commissioner lewis

1:14:22 ↗ thank you chair boys commissioner joy

1:14:23 ↗ lewis so i'm actually gonna make a

1:14:25 ↗ second motion we still have to vote on

1:14:26 ↗ the first motion um but i'm actually

1:14:29 ↗ gonna make a second one because i think

1:14:30 ↗ that we actually have

1:14:32 ↗ three options in front of us now so one

1:14:34 ↗ is option one one is option two which

1:14:37 ↗ has been which has been motioned and i'm

1:14:39 ↗ gonna make um

1:14:41 ↗ make a second uh motion to add the

1:14:43 ↗ language into section seven that says

1:14:45 ↗ that the chair and staff's discretion

1:14:47 ↗ additional public comments may be

1:14:49 ↗ included in the in the agenda

1:14:51 ↗ and

1:14:53 ↗ uh i'll look and see if i have a second

1:14:55 ↗ to that adding that language instead to

1:14:56 ↗ section seven rather than adding it to

1:14:59 ↗ our agenda piece i think

1:15:07 ↗ your voice your muted thank you steven

1:15:11 ↗ is there possibly any way we could get

1:15:12 ↗ the um motions to be written into the

1:15:14 ↗ chat box that might be helpful i've seen

1:15:17 ↗ that done once or twice

1:15:19 ↗ uh just to help

1:15:20 ↗ make sure this is uh cleaning chair

1:15:23 ↗ voice i would actually suggest going

1:15:25 ↗ through the vote for the first motion

1:15:27 ↗ and then

1:15:28 ↗ acting on the second motion from

1:15:29 ↗ commissioner lewis

1:15:32 ↗ okay so on the first motion i believe

1:15:34 ↗ that was to look at option two

1:15:36 ↗ um i believe now that we've discussed it

1:15:38 ↗ would be we're going for a vote correct

1:15:42 ↗ chair this is this is tisha excuse

1:15:45 ↗ excuse the interruption i have a sort of

1:15:47 ↗ efficient

1:15:48 ↗ way to deal with this which is that um

1:15:51 ↗ commissioner lewis could offer this as a

1:15:53 ↗ substitute amendment

1:15:55 ↗ to her prior amendment

1:15:57 ↗ and then you could ask if there are any

1:16:00 ↗ objections to substituting so be

1:16:04 ↗ swapping out

1:16:06 ↗ i appreciate that um commissioner lewis

1:16:08 ↗ said

1:16:09 ↗ would you like to make a substitution

1:16:12 ↗ yes chair voice commissioner joy lewis

1:16:14 ↗ i'd very much like to make a

1:16:15 ↗ substitution to my first motion to the

1:16:18 ↗ second motion that was stated and i'm

1:16:20 ↗ typing now thank you

1:16:22 ↗ great thank you is there any objection

1:16:24 ↗ to um

1:16:26 ↗ to commissioners lewis's

1:16:29 ↗ preference of substituting

1:16:34 ↗ hearing none

1:16:38 ↗ and i'm just going to chime in because i

1:16:40 ↗ was the seconder

1:16:41 ↗ and i and i think if i'm remembering

1:16:43 ↗ rules as the seconder i have to

1:16:46 ↗ um

1:16:49 ↗ comment on whether the substitution i

1:16:51 ↗ agree with that and which i do and i did

1:16:54 ↗ in the comments

1:16:56 ↗ thank you commissioner milligan you know

1:16:58 ↗ what i tried to look for last with last

1:17:00 ↗ weekend i bought a roberts rules book

1:17:03 ↗ that i bought when i first got on the

1:17:04 ↗ commission and i just got to find it

1:17:07 ↗ but yeah i've got some reading about

1:17:09 ↗ some of these more legalese approaches

1:17:11 ↗ but it's all very interesting all very

1:17:13 ↗ fascinating

1:17:19 ↗ so then i don't know if you formally

1:17:20 ↗ seconded the substitute motion but i'm

1:17:23 ↗ happy to second if it hasn't been

1:17:31 ↗ you can go ahead and say all right

1:17:32 ↗ commissioner

1:17:33 ↗ one second

1:17:40 ↗ so and now here's another part so now

1:17:42 ↗ that uh

1:17:44 ↗ that has all been agreed to and seconded

1:17:47 ↗ and non-objected

1:17:48 ↗ now we have commissioner lewis's

1:17:50 ↗ substitution commissioner lewis would

1:17:52 ↗ you like to read it aloud

1:17:58 ↗ thank you chair voice commissioner joy

1:17:59 ↗ lewis the motion before us is

1:18:01 ↗ at the chair and staff's discretion

1:18:03 ↗ additional public comments may be

1:18:05 ↗ included in the published agenda topics

1:18:13 ↗ do we have a second

1:18:17 ↗ bag

1:18:22 ↗ all right well we have a second so now

1:18:24 ↗ um i believe we will take a vote

1:18:29 ↗ god help me that's got to be right right

1:18:34 ↗ so stephen would you like to take the

1:18:35 ↗ role for the vote

1:18:38 ↗ yes all right so we are going to take

1:18:42 ↗ roll for

1:18:46 ↗ this motion

1:18:48 ↗ running through

1:18:51 ↗ commissioner

1:18:52 ↗ milligan

1:18:54 ↗ aye

1:18:56 ↗ commissioner bader

1:18:58 ↗ hi

1:19:01 ↗ mr monahan

1:19:03 ↗ hi

1:19:04 ↗ commissioner lewis

1:19:07 ↗ hi

1:19:08 ↗ chair voice

1:19:13 ↗ hi

1:19:20 ↗ to your voice you have

1:19:22 ↗ unanimous consent

1:19:27 ↗ great thank you everyone

1:19:31 ↗ um

1:19:32 ↗ all right so i believe stephen we are

1:19:34 ↗ now moving a path from amendment three

1:19:37 ↗ and continuing on with

1:19:39 ↗ the

1:19:40 ↗ final three

1:19:42 ↗ correct so the final three amendments uh

1:19:44 ↗ came from commissioner suggestions that

1:19:46 ↗ we received what i'll do is i'll explain

1:19:49 ↗ each of them and then answer any

1:19:50 ↗ questions that commissioners may have

1:19:52 ↗ i may ask the commissioner who

1:19:54 ↗ recommended the edits to add on if in

1:19:57 ↗ case i missed anything

1:19:59 ↗ so the first amendment

1:20:01 ↗ deals with the section that deal that

1:20:03 ↗ focuses on the selection of alternates

1:20:06 ↗ and

1:20:07 ↗ the edit is to change the selection of

1:20:10 ↗ alternates when a regular member is

1:20:12 ↗ unable to attend

1:20:14 ↗ by selecting

1:20:16 ↗ alternate members who arrive earliest to

1:20:18 ↗ the meeting versus selection by

1:20:21 ↗ seniority

1:20:27 ↗ giving you all a chance to read through

1:20:28 ↗ it

1:20:30 ↗ and then so the options for you all

1:20:34 ↗ tonight is considering

1:20:35 ↗ not adding the edit requires no action

1:20:38 ↗ or making the edit um which requires a

1:20:41 ↗ motion

1:20:44 ↗ and i'll leave the edit on the screen

1:20:47 ↗ for you all to consider

1:20:53 ↗ commissioner lewis

1:20:56 ↗ thank you chair voice commissioner joy

1:20:57 ↗ lewis i'd like emotion i'd like to make

1:21:00 ↗ a motion uh to adopt the amendment of

1:21:02 ↗ option two

1:21:12 ↗ is there anyone who'd like to second

1:21:16 ↗ commissioner milligan

1:21:18 ↗ i'm going to second it for the

1:21:21 ↗ discussion

1:21:22 ↗ thank you chairman i'm continuous

1:21:28 ↗ all right we have a motion on the floor

1:21:30 ↗ so stephen if you'd like to take

1:21:32 ↗ the roll for a boat

1:21:36 ↗ uh first chair voice you have to uh ask

1:21:38 ↗ for a discussion

1:21:40 ↗ nope apologies

1:21:42 ↗ discussion

1:21:44 ↗ um

1:21:45 ↗ is there any discussion about the

1:21:47 ↗ emotion

1:21:52 ↗ commissioner milligan

1:21:54 ↗ uh i would allow the

1:21:57 ↗ the motion maker to come at first if she

1:22:00 ↗ wanted to do you want to

1:22:05 ↗ yeah

1:22:06 ↗ let commissioner lewis go first and i'll

1:22:08 ↗ go after her

1:22:10 ↗ okay please commissioner lewis thank you

1:22:12 ↗ chair boys commissioner joy lewis uh and

1:22:15 ↗ thank you to commissioner uh milligan i

1:22:17 ↗ will uh i will say that i um i can't

1:22:20 ↗ speak to if i was the only one but i am

1:22:22 ↗ certainly the one of the people who

1:22:23 ↗ reached out to staff to make a comment

1:22:25 ↗ on this historically uh how we run in

1:22:28 ↗ ppc is to do the alternate who arrives

1:22:30 ↗ first to the meeting that obviously is a

1:22:32 ↗ little harder in a virtual format

1:22:35 ↗ but what it really addresses is issues

1:22:37 ↗ of equity

1:22:39 ↗ and transparency

1:22:40 ↗ what we want to make sure that we do is

1:22:42 ↗ that we have a place where all members

1:22:44 ↗ feel that they are welcome and instead

1:22:46 ↗ of having a hierarchy of who served the

1:22:49 ↗ longest

1:22:50 ↗ we would then be having a person who has

1:22:52 ↗ decided to arrive as is traditionally

1:22:55 ↗ how we how we've done it i think it's

1:22:56 ↗ worked very well uh and i think that we

1:22:59 ↗ can get into some issues right now with

1:23:00 ↗ trying to talk about who's been on the

1:23:02 ↗ longest i will say for the person with

1:23:05 ↗ their granny glasses on for uh the

1:23:07 ↗ longest serving member of ppc right now

1:23:09 ↗ we've never actually had an alternate

1:23:11 ↗ have a second term um in our stay so we

1:23:14 ↗ our alternates are often uh decide to

1:23:16 ↗ stay with us for a short period of time

1:23:18 ↗ and so this is kind of something that

1:23:21 ↗ is a little bit moot because we don't

1:23:22 ↗ tend to have long-serving alternates

1:23:25 ↗ but obviously in a fully functioning and

1:23:27 ↗ working commission that is what we'd

1:23:29 ↗ like to see so that is why i suggested

1:23:31 ↗ this

1:23:36 ↗ thank you commissioner lewis

1:23:37 ↗ commissioner milligan

1:23:40 ↗ thank you man of milligan here uh number

1:23:43 ↗ one i want to ask uh clarification this

1:23:45 ↗ kind of confuses me a little bit but

1:23:47 ↗ this has to do with the selection of

1:23:48 ↗ alternates to make sure i'm in the right

1:23:50 ↗ section of the document during a meeting

1:23:54 ↗ and so during a meeting

1:23:57 ↗ the selection of an alternate to be

1:24:02 ↗ say upgraded

1:24:03 ↗ to a voting member when we're on the

1:24:06 ↗ diocese and it's

1:24:07 ↗ worked in other commissions before very

1:24:10 ↗ elegantly that when we're looking for

1:24:12 ↗ our quorum in the room

1:24:14 ↗ if an alternate is upgraded to a voting

1:24:17 ↗ member they move in a chair

1:24:20 ↗ and then the other people who come in

1:24:22 ↗ sit outside that and it makes for a very

1:24:25 ↗ visible

1:24:26 ↗ meeting management

1:24:29 ↗ it makes it obvious who's voting and

1:24:31 ↗ who's not voting

1:24:32 ↗ when we don't do that when you don't

1:24:34 ↗ move up a chair in the um in the array

1:24:37 ↗ of of um the quorum on the diocese uh it

1:24:41 ↗ can be kind of confusing so mine is

1:24:43 ↗ simply my support is simply for the

1:24:45 ↗ logistics of the meeting

1:24:47 ↗ and and nothing more complicated than

1:24:50 ↗ that

1:24:50 ↗ thank you

1:24:55 ↗ great thank you both commissioners both

1:24:57 ↗ excellent points

1:24:59 ↗ would anyone else like to commission

1:25:02 ↗ vice chairman

1:25:04 ↗ i'm good with this i agree with joy's

1:25:06 ↗ amendment

1:25:13 ↗ okay is there anyone else who'd like to

1:25:14 ↗ discuss this particular uh

1:25:17 ↗ motion

1:25:21 ↗ all right now i believe we're ready for

1:25:22 ↗ roll call

1:25:28 ↗ stop

1:25:29 ↗ go ahead please touch it

1:25:32 ↗ hi chair um commissioner milligan you

1:25:33 ↗ brought up a great point which got me

1:25:35 ↗ looking um in the replacement rules

1:25:39 ↗ and i think there's some language

1:25:41 ↗ in this proposed new section that says

1:25:44 ↗ if it's known in advance that a regular

1:25:46 ↗ member will be absent staff will notify

1:25:48 ↗ an alternate member in advance of the

1:25:50 ↗ meeting

1:25:51 ↗ and requests they serve in the absence

1:25:53 ↗ of the regular member and then that's

1:25:55 ↗ where the provision for the

1:25:58 ↗ alternate be selected based on seniority

1:26:00 ↗ comes in

1:26:02 ↗ so thank you for highlighting that i'm

1:26:05 ↗ sharing that i guess for the

1:26:06 ↗ commission's consideration if you

1:26:09 ↗ you i suppose you could carve out two

1:26:11 ↗ situations

1:26:13 ↗ so tisha actually uh

1:26:16 ↗ right when you jumped out i was about to

1:26:18 ↗ speak to it we actually have uh

1:26:20 ↗ additional edit to that section you're

1:26:22 ↗ speaking of

1:26:23 ↗ on

1:26:24 ↗ the

1:26:25 ↗ notification of alternates

1:26:27 ↗ so we'll get to that one next

1:26:36 ↗ well thank you thank you staff um

1:26:39 ↗ any further discussion

1:26:43 ↗ all right if we could please take the

1:26:45 ↗ role for a vote

1:26:47 ↗ okay commissioner vader

1:26:49 ↗ hey

1:26:51 ↗ commissioner milligan

1:26:53 ↗ aye

1:26:56 ↗ vice chair monahan

1:26:57 ↗ hi

1:26:59 ↗ commissioner lewis

1:27:01 ↗ i

1:27:02 ↗ enter a voice

1:27:06 ↗ i

1:27:08 ↗ the motion passes

1:27:14 ↗ okay moving on to the next amendment

1:27:20 ↗ so

1:27:21 ↗ as a great segue on alternates um

1:27:25 ↗ the there is an additional edit uh

1:27:27 ↗ requested to

1:27:29 ↗ change the notifications so that is

1:27:30 ↗ there's more

1:27:33 ↗ advanced certification to alternates

1:27:35 ↗ when

1:27:36 ↗ it's known in events when a regular

1:27:37 ↗ member isn't able to attend uh a meeting

1:27:41 ↗ so that the language is changed so that

1:27:44 ↗ all confirmed attendees will be notified

1:27:47 ↗ of

1:27:48 ↗ an uh regular member's absence and

1:27:51 ↗ encourage the alternates to

1:27:54 ↗ prepare in advance for the meeting

1:27:56 ↗ in the case that they serve as a regular

1:27:58 ↗ member in the meeting and so the chair

1:28:01 ↗ and then there is additional language

1:28:02 ↗ where the chair will announce

1:28:04 ↗ which alternates will be voting members

1:28:06 ↗ for the meeting

1:28:08 ↗ and that this will be noted in the

1:28:09 ↗ minutes

1:28:12 ↗ so the options for consideration is

1:28:15 ↗ no action which would not add the edit

1:28:17 ↗ and then option two which is to

1:28:20 ↗ uh make a motion to add these edits and

1:28:22 ↗ i'll go back to the edits for the

1:28:24 ↗ commission's consideration

1:28:33 ↗ is there anyone who'd like to make a

1:28:34 ↗ motion to add these edits

1:28:37 ↗ to amendment 5.

1:28:51 ↗ hearing none

1:28:52 ↗ option one

1:28:56 ↗ up

1:28:58 ↗ mr lewis

1:29:01 ↗ sorry chair voice commissioner joy lewis

1:29:03 ↗ i wasn't fast enough i'd like to make a

1:29:05 ↗ motion uh on the amendment for option

1:29:07 ↗ two to adopt the language in front of us

1:29:10 ↗ for notice notification of alternates

1:29:20 ↗ is there a second to commissioner

1:29:21 ↗ lewis's motion

1:29:42 ↗ chair voice here on you

1:29:46 ↗ thank you steven so i don't see a second

1:29:50 ↗ like like i said this will be a lot

1:29:52 ↗ easier when we're on the dice because i

1:29:53 ↗ can't see everyone all the time

1:29:55 ↗ um

1:29:57 ↗ looks like that motion has failed

1:30:01 ↗ moving on to the next amendment

1:30:06 ↗ and this is our last amendment that

1:30:07 ↗ we'll be uh discussing tonight this one

1:30:10 ↗ is to

1:30:10 ↗ [Music]

1:30:13 ↗ amend the

1:30:15 ↗ language related to

1:30:17 ↗ member participation and that was to

1:30:20 ↗ keep

1:30:21 ↗ the discussion of members should be

1:30:23 ↗ relevant to the business pending and

1:30:26 ↗ removing the concise to the point so

1:30:28 ↗ that it is more of a open dialogue

1:30:36 ↗ and then the options for this is option

1:30:38 ↗ one do not edit

1:30:40 ↗ which requires no action or option to

1:30:42 ↗ make the edit which requires a motion

1:30:46 ↗ i'll go back to the edit

1:30:54 ↗ okay do we have a motion

1:30:57 ↗ to allow the edits for amendment six

1:31:02 ↗ we have a question from commissioner

1:31:03 ↗ lewis

1:31:05 ↗ thank you chair voice i i uh the

1:31:07 ↗ commissioner joy lewis i will not be

1:31:09 ↗ making a motion to support this language

1:31:11 ↗ change however i do want to say to staff

1:31:13 ↗ that uh what i

1:31:16 ↗ what i would like to do is to have uh

1:31:18 ↗ the this commission to have a discussion

1:31:20 ↗ and a recommendation where we would put

1:31:22 ↗ effectively the language we've been

1:31:24 ↗ using as a comment to the white board

1:31:26 ↗ and to pass along to uh to staff and to

1:31:28 ↗ counsel that our newest former board the

1:31:31 ↗ of our equity board

1:31:33 ↗ i would love for them to have an item to

1:31:35 ↗ be able to look at our bylaws

1:31:37 ↗ right now i feel that we're missing

1:31:39 ↗ language

1:31:40 ↗ that is really inclusive to all members

1:31:42 ↗ of our community right now we want to

1:31:44 ↗ allow for having

1:31:45 ↗ people from different walks of life to

1:31:47 ↗ be able to participate to be

1:31:48 ↗ participants in this in this process and

1:31:50 ↗ being able to have members of our

1:31:52 ↗ community that are english as a second

1:31:54 ↗ language neurodivergent and elderly

1:31:56 ↗ right now it's not captured in our

1:31:58 ↗ bylaws and i think that it would be

1:32:00 ↗ easy depending on how the

1:32:03 ↗ meetings are being run to be able to use

1:32:05 ↗ this language to stifle a variety of

1:32:08 ↗ voices and so instead what i think is

1:32:10 ↗ that it needs to be looked at from our

1:32:12 ↗ equity board

1:32:13 ↗ for all commissions and boards to be

1:32:14 ↗ able to have language that is more up to

1:32:17 ↗ date

1:32:18 ↗ thank you

1:32:24 ↗ thank you commissioner lewis uh

1:32:25 ↗ commissioner milligan has a question

1:32:28 ↗ uh yes i'm sorry i'm not fast enough to

1:32:30 ↗ look it up myself and robert's rules on

1:32:32 ↗ my phone um is concise

1:32:35 ↗ to the point and

1:32:37 ↗ is that a quote from

1:32:40 ↗ robert's rules of order

1:32:45 ↗ you know i will ask tisha if she's able

1:32:48 ↗ to remember the discussion that was had

1:32:50 ↗ with the development commission when

1:32:51 ↗ they adopted this language

1:32:55 ↗ commissioner milligan i um i have

1:32:58 ↗ studied robert's rules um extensively i

1:33:01 ↗ can't tell you quickly if that is exact

1:33:04 ↗ language i'll

1:33:05 ↗ um

1:33:06 ↗ but robert's rules is about running an

1:33:09 ↗ efficient meeting while ensuring equal

1:33:12 ↗ participation by all members so the

1:33:15 ↗ informal rules in robert's rules um

1:33:19 ↗ for

1:33:20 ↗ it's a little complicated but um the

1:33:22 ↗ recommendation is that

1:33:25 ↗ members can speak up to 10 minutes on

1:33:27 ↗ each topic twice

1:33:30 ↗ during any particular topic but there

1:33:32 ↗ are different rules for small boards of

1:33:34 ↗ 12 members and less which is exactly

1:33:36 ↗ what the ppc is and so in small boards

1:33:39 ↗ of 12 members and less there is robert's

1:33:41 ↗ rules doesn't prescribe any particular

1:33:45 ↗ time frame it just says you should

1:33:47 ↗ attempt to provide you know everyone an

1:33:50 ↗ opportunity to speak once before anyone

1:33:52 ↗ speaks the second time

1:33:53 ↗ so i think that um

1:33:56 ↗ i think the board or the commission has

1:33:58 ↗ discretion to modify this roberts rules

1:34:01 ↗ does talk a lot about having germaine

1:34:03 ↗ comments

1:34:04 ↗ so that word relevant i think is

1:34:07 ↗ important but the rest of the words

1:34:08 ↗ there i think

1:34:10 ↗ you know i don't know how meaningful

1:34:12 ↗ they

1:34:13 ↗ or important they really are

1:34:24 ↗ thank you

1:34:26 ↗ does anyone else have any questions or

1:34:27 ↗ comments

1:34:33 ↗ would anyone like to make a motion

1:34:41 ↗ all right

1:34:42 ↗ i have to go through my screen to make

1:34:44 ↗ sure i see everybody

1:34:45 ↗ hearing none

1:34:48 ↗ i'm in six as presented

1:34:52 ↗ earlier

1:34:57 ↗ chair voice that concludes all the major

1:34:59 ↗ amendments that were proposed by

1:35:01 ↗ commissioners

1:35:04 ↗ nothing like trial by fire yeah so

1:35:07 ↗ appreciate staff and appreciate their

1:35:09 ↗ fantastic colleagues on the commission

1:35:12 ↗ it didn't look fun it was

1:35:16 ↗ uh commissioner lewis has a comment

1:35:19 ↗ sorry i did it again it's really a

1:35:20 ↗ question stephen i had had one more

1:35:22 ↗ thing i had emailed you about which was

1:35:24 ↗ um section 13 3 about limiting the use

1:35:26 ↗ of technology um was that

1:35:29 ↗ uh was that either stricken or were we

1:35:31 ↗ going to talk about it or

1:35:34 ↗ we so

1:35:35 ↗ when i discussed the language with tasha

1:35:38 ↗ that what your suggestion was actually

1:35:40 ↗ the intent of the language it just was

1:35:43 ↗ poorly worded so we made the edit and so

1:35:45 ↗ because it kept to the intent of what

1:35:47 ↗ was what we were trying to do

1:35:49 ↗ we didn't feel like we needed to have

1:35:51 ↗ the discussion with the commission and

1:35:53 ↗ for the other commissioners benefited

1:35:55 ↗ this conversation

1:35:56 ↗ at the end of the roles and rules and

1:35:59 ↗ regulations there's a section on code of

1:36:00 ↗ conduct that spoke to

1:36:02 ↗ accessing

1:36:04 ↗ the meeting materials via digital

1:36:06 ↗ devices

1:36:09 ↗ and the

1:36:11 ↗ uh intent was we do want the uh the

1:36:14 ↗ commissioners to be accessing the

1:36:16 ↗ materials

1:36:17 ↗ via digital devices but we want to limit

1:36:20 ↗ communications between commissioners and

1:36:22 ↗ members with the public via digital

1:36:24 ↗ devices so that we maintain the

1:36:26 ↗ transparency of conversations for the

1:36:29 ↗ commission meetings

1:36:38 ↗ thank you stephen

1:36:41 ↗ all right

1:36:43 ↗ if there's no first further amendments

1:36:45 ↗ or additional conversation i believe

1:36:47 ↗ that leads us to reports

1:36:49 ↗ uh city council updates

1:36:54 ↗ we have to do one more motion and vote

1:36:59 ↗ okay

1:37:01 ↗ so i'll make a motion to adopt the

1:37:02 ↗ replacement rules considering

1:37:04 ↗ the discussed amendments

1:37:13 ↗ all second

1:37:15 ↗ milligan

1:37:18 ↗ thank you commissioner milligan um

1:37:21 ↗ any further debate or discussion

1:37:29 ↗ we'll give it a second here

1:37:33 ↗ chair uh this is tisha just confirming

1:37:35 ↗ this would be including adopted

1:37:36 ↗ amendments which i i think ultimately

1:37:38 ↗ there was one

1:37:46 ↗ all right we'll do roll call for uh the

1:37:49 ↗ motion that's on the floor

1:37:52 ↗ hey commissioner vader

1:37:54 ↗ hey

1:37:56 ↗ mr lewis

1:38:00 ↗ aye

1:38:01 ↗ commissioner milligan

1:38:03 ↗ i

1:38:05 ↗ vice chair monahan hi

1:38:08 ↗ i'm chair voice

1:38:10 ↗ hi

1:38:12 ↗ motion passes

1:38:17 ↗ all right well thank you everybody yes

1:38:19 ↗ the most important one that we had to do

1:38:20 ↗ and

1:38:22 ↗ it shows you know a little bit of a

1:38:24 ↗ learning curve so now we get to

1:38:26 ↗ uh agenda item number five reports so

1:38:29 ↗ i'd like to ask minnie or steven and

1:38:31 ↗ minnie's not here tonight so

1:38:33 ↗ i'd like to ask stephen do we have any

1:38:35 ↗ city council updates

1:38:37 ↗ just really quick updates um the

1:38:41 ↗ planning council committee is going to

1:38:42 ↗ be considering bucket 3 from the title

1:38:46 ↗ 18 at next week's meeting

1:38:49 ↗ otherwise and

1:38:50 ↗ i think we will have an additional

1:38:52 ↗ update at your meeting next week

1:38:55 ↗ on kind of how that discussion goes with

1:38:57 ↗ the council committee

1:39:00 ↗ that's it for council updates

1:39:05 ↗ all right um stephen do we have any

1:39:07 ↗ other business or announcements

1:39:09 ↗ i do have one final announcement um

1:39:12 ↗ the staff receives a

1:39:15 ↗ resignation from the new member kelly

1:39:18 ↗ from the planning policy commission she

1:39:20 ↗ received a new job offer which

1:39:24 ↗ was a bigger time commitment than she

1:39:26 ↗ thinks she will be able to be able to

1:39:28 ↗ maintain um

1:39:30 ↗ at least her attendance for commissioner

1:39:32 ↗ so she submitted her resignation

1:39:36 ↗ so the

1:39:38 ↗ commission will be operating with five

1:39:39 ↗ members for a while we are have been in

1:39:42 ↗ discussion with the city clerk's office

1:39:44 ↗ to have a special recruitment process in

1:39:46 ↗ the fall and so that's something that

1:39:47 ↗ we'll be working with the chairs

1:39:49 ↗ later this year

1:39:54 ↗ great thank you steven yeah um

1:39:57 ↗ makes it quite difficult we've got a

1:39:58 ↗ summer coming up where everybody after

1:40:00 ↗ two years of uh pandemic mode probably

1:40:02 ↗ wants to go out

1:40:04 ↗ and travel and we still have this heavy

1:40:06 ↗ weight above us called title 18 so that

1:40:09 ↗ means more than one absence and we're

1:40:11 ↗ going to have to start doing some

1:40:12 ↗ reshuffling so again the previous point

1:40:14 ↗ made

1:40:16 ↗ as much advance notice is always

1:40:18 ↗ appreciated so when people do have plans

1:40:20 ↗ this summer

1:40:21 ↗ logistically with the few pieces on the

1:40:24 ↗ board that we have it's gonna even

1:40:25 ↗ become more important

1:40:28 ↗ all right

1:40:29 ↗ i believe that leads to adjournment so

1:40:31 ↗ is there any comments discussion for the

1:40:34 ↗ good of our order

1:40:39 ↗ well thank you everyone for being here

1:40:42 ↗ and we're going to adjourn at 8 11

1:40:45 ↗ p.m thank you everybody

1:40:47 ↗ thank

1:40:48 ↗ you thank you everybody katisha and

1:40:51 ↗ anne-marie and valerie and steven oh and

1:40:55 ↗ all you guys too

1:40:57 ↗ thank you

Approved minutes

Extracted from the next meeting's packet, where this meeting's minutes were approved as a consent-calendar attachment.

Open PDF

Attendance

Council / Members (5)

Voiss

Vice-Chair Monahan

Commissioners Bader

Lewis

Milligan

Staff (1)

Tisha Gieser, City Clerk Stephen Padua, Long Range Planning Manager Ann Marie Soto, Madrona Law 2