City Council Services, Safety & Parks Committee · Tuesday, February 25, 2025 · City Council Digest

3. APPROVAL OF MINUTES

Minutes of January 28, 2025

packet pp.5–6

Open packet at p.5 ↗

Staff report:

APPROVAL OF MINUTES a) 01-28-25 City Council Services, Safety & Parks Page (1) Committee Minutes CITY OF ISSAQUAH City Council Services, Safety & Parks Committee 6:30 PM Council Chambers, 135 E. January 28, 2025 MINUTES Sunset Way, Issaquah WA

4. AGENDA ITEMS

FLOCK Camera System COM 0089

60 min · Chief Paula Schwan, Issaquah Police Chief · packet pp.7–25

▶ Watch from 1:52 Open packet at p.7 ↗

Staff report:

Staff recommends Committee approve the use of the FLOCK camera system by the City of Issaquah and move the item forward to the full council for adoption.

919 segments .txt ↗

0:23 ↗ welcome everyone I council member toam

0:24 ↗ Mars called the Tuesday February 25th

0:27 ↗ city council services safety and Parks

0:30 ↗ committee meeting to

0:31 ↗ order and uh the first thing that we

0:34 ↗ have on the agenda for this evening let

0:37 ↗ me just go to my uh packet here sorry

0:40 ↗ should have had it open already uh is

0:43 ↗ public

0:44 ↗ comment uh we do not have any members of

0:47 ↗ the public present with us in the room

0:50 ↗ uh Chris do we have any members of the

0:51 ↗ public online at this time we have no

0:54 ↗ virtual attendees at this time chair

0:56 ↗ Mars all right well then we will

0:58 ↗ continue forward word then um into our

1:02 ↗ next item which is approval of

1:07 ↗ minutes would you care to make a motion

1:10 ↗ Deputy council president sure I'll move

1:12 ↗ uh that we accept the minutes of the

1:14 ↗ January 28th 25 meeting I will second

1:18 ↗ that all those in favor say I I opposed

1:22 ↗ extensions that passes Two To Zero by

1:24 ↗ the way uh we had uh we did our re uh

1:29 ↗ what's word I'm looking for musical

1:31 ↗ chairs musical chairs uh for committees

1:35 ↗ and uh out with the old in with the new

1:37 ↗ uh we uh thank uh council member Joe for

1:40 ↗ being on the committee last year and

1:42 ↗ we'll be welcoming back council member

1:44 ↗ Ry uh onto this group but neither of

1:47 ↗ those individuals were available this

1:49 ↗ evening so Barb and I is what you get uh

1:52 ↗ with that we will move on to agenda item

1:54 ↗ Co 0089 flock camera system presented to

1:58 ↗ us by Chief Schwan

2:09 ↗ uh your

2:10 ↗ microphone there thank you very

2:13 ↗ much perfect thank

2:16 ↗ you okay excellent so um tonight we I'm

2:20 ↗ here to talk about flock cameras um

2:23 ↗ cameras that are actually been in our

2:25 ↗ city for a couple years now and that we

2:27 ↗ have access to and there's many

2:29 ↗ different jurisdictions around us that

2:31 ↗ are actually using these cameras so i'

2:33 ↗ just like to give you an overview of

2:34 ↗ what they are how many actually are in

2:36 ↗ our state how many um with our local

2:38 ↗ surrounding agencies that they have what

2:40 ↗ they can and cannot do some of the

2:42 ↗ misnomers and different things along

2:44 ↗ those lines next slide

2:47 ↗ please so the direction we're needed

2:49 ↗ from the safety and Services Commission

2:51 ↗ is we're asking that the service Safety

2:54 ↗ and Parks Council committee for input on

2:56 ↗ the discussion for purchasing flock

2:58 ↗ cameras as a supplement to to Aid law

3:00 ↗ enforcement in keeping citizens

3:04 ↗ safe next

3:06 ↗ slide so a little bit of background

3:08 ↗ about the cameras what an alpr or flock

3:12 ↗ camera is so an alpr camera there's a

3:15 ↗ misnomer and we've actually had these in

3:16 ↗ the cities for a very long time more

3:19 ↗ than 10 years they used to be and a lot

3:21 ↗ of jurisdictions have them on the cars

3:23 ↗ on the patrol cars specifically they

3:25 ↗ look a little awkward sometimes they

3:27 ↗ look like speakers on the top of the car

3:28 ↗ but they're actually cameras that are

3:30 ↗ watching all around so like when a car

3:32 ↗ pulls into a patrol car pulls into a

3:33 ↗ parking lot can read all the cameras

3:35 ↗ that are around them and we did have

3:37 ↗ those originally um when I came on

3:40 ↗ almost eight years ago now uh since then

3:43 ↗ and they were very time consuming

3:45 ↗ because we had to enter all the plates

3:47 ↗ in that came to us um so it was very uh

3:50 ↗ wasn't as effective as it could have

3:52 ↗ been these flock cameras aren't just an

3:55 ↗ alpr they don't just read license plates

3:57 ↗ so that is a little bit of a misnomer

4:00 ↗ um and that's what Alp it's an automatic

4:01 ↗ license plate reader and they use high

4:04 ↗ definition camera and Technology to read

4:07 ↗ license plates but we are the ones as

4:08 ↗ officers that have to upload and

4:10 ↗ Implement those different plates

4:12 ↗ themselves uh the First

4:14 ↗ Data first uh this data can then be

4:17 ↗ checked again with criminal database in

4:19 ↗ our systems for wanted website which is

4:22 ↗ our ncic which automatically connects to

4:24 ↗ that in our computer systems and so

4:26 ↗ these cameras are similar but they're

4:29 ↗ they're more than just the alpr now that

4:32 ↗ doesn't mean and I can tell you what

4:33 ↗ they're not that's another slide so um

4:35 ↗ next slide please so what a flat camera

4:38 ↗ is not it's not facial recognition in

4:41 ↗ fact the reality is they get a better

4:43 ↗ read from a car that's on the back end

4:46 ↗ so for example I'm getting a little bit

4:49 ↗ down in my comments but if we were to

4:51 ↗ put any of those in the Ingress or

4:53 ↗ egress of our city they would be on the

4:55 ↗ rear end facing of the vehicles and

4:58 ↗ that's what they're looking for most

4:59 ↗ read better on the back end of the car

5:01 ↗ than they ever do on the front and I

5:03 ↗ don't know if that's because they're

5:03 ↗ lower or what that reasoning is but they

5:06 ↗ do read mostly from the rear end of the

5:08 ↗ vehicle so we're not looking to do

5:11 ↗ facial recognition um it does not

5:13 ↗ collect biometric or sensitive

5:15 ↗ information like fingerprints um like

5:17 ↗ any other facial information at all or

5:20 ↗ anything specific regarding the vehicle

5:23 ↗ or the persons inside the vehicle more

5:24 ↗ specifically and it's not used for

5:26 ↗ tracking speed or parking violations

5:29 ↗ those again are not things that they're

5:30 ↗ used for um that's not what we're

5:32 ↗ recommending we're not going to use a

5:34 ↗ camera to zoom in and go oh okay there's

5:37 ↗ a parking violation there now I'm going

5:38 ↗ to send out a car in actuality we can't

5:41 ↗ even access these the ones that we

5:43 ↗ already have access to we're not allowed

5:46 ↗ to go into those because it's the

5:48 ↗ auditing process unless you have an

5:50 ↗ actual case number that you're there for

5:53 ↗ so we would have to have got called on

5:55 ↗ there being a case or crime in that area

5:57 ↗ or report that has a case number before

6:00 ↗ we could ever even access the cameras

6:02 ↗ for anything specific in any of the

6:04 ↗ areas next slide

6:06 ↗ please so things to know there's over 69

6:10 ↗ agencies in Washington to date with

6:12 ↗ active flock camera systems total of

6:15 ↗ four flock camera systems um actually

6:18 ↗ there's a total of four flock camera

6:20 ↗ systems sharing their data with the city

6:22 ↗ of isqua police department today but we

6:25 ↗ actually have 10 live flock cameras in

6:28 ↗ the city that are personally owned owned

6:30 ↗ or privately owned I should say and so

6:33 ↗ we don't yet have access to those other

6:35 ↗ six but there are six or 10 total in the

6:38 ↗ city and we do have access to four block

6:41 ↗ has a transparency page um I put the

6:43 ↗ link in there it's on the bottom um I

6:46 ↗ would highly recommend going in there it

6:48 ↗ gives all the type of data all the type

6:50 ↗ of information we can look up all the

6:53 ↗ access and different things that

6:54 ↗ different agencies have ran as far as

6:56 ↗ stolen plates they've caught in initial

6:59 ↗ uh initially had contact with all those

7:01 ↗ different things um very good page for

7:05 ↗ staff to be looking at and reviewing um

7:07 ↗ to see that everybody would have access

7:09 ↗ that for that as well for those of us

7:11 ↗ that would have those cameras in

7:13 ↗ place and um yeah it's open to the

7:15 ↗ public so any of our citizens would be

7:17 ↗ able also to go on there and view the

7:19 ↗ transparency page there's nothing that

7:21 ↗ we're hiding to show that we're looking

7:23 ↗ up you know your neighbor nobody can

7:24 ↗ look at your neighbor by having them

7:26 ↗ that's not the direction and there also

7:28 ↗ have a where they can't zoom into like

7:31 ↗ Windows that's that's not the idea

7:34 ↗ either um audits are easily tracked

7:37 ↗ through the flock system to ensure the

7:39 ↗ oversight and compliance with the actual

7:41 ↗ policy they have in place next slide

7:44 ↗ please here is a list of all the law

7:47 ↗ enforcement Partners in Washington which

7:49 ↗ there are great many of them and I have

7:52 ↗ a list of actually how many each one of

7:54 ↗ these cities have in place currently uh

7:57 ↗ just wanted to show you a large overview

7:59 ↗ of those 69 agencies next slide

8:03 ↗ please so current neighboring

8:05 ↗ jurisdictions which is very important

8:07 ↗ for us typically to see the ones that

8:08 ↗ are neighboring to us Redmond has 25

8:10 ↗ currently Clyde Hill and Madina it says

8:12 ↗ they have eight cameras but I know they

8:14 ↗ implemented a bunch more and I believe

8:16 ↗ there's a bunch more privately owned as

8:17 ↗ well this is the public owned ones

8:20 ↗ Normandy Park with two Lynwood has 25

8:23 ↗ Newcastle was seven Black Diamond with

8:25 ↗ six ritton 24 tuilla with 35 and Bonnie

8:29 ↗ Lake with 23 and that's just those

8:32 ↗ surrounding agencies and I know and I've

8:34 ↗ heard from several of these Chiefs

8:36 ↗ personally that they've been very

8:37 ↗ helpful in uh with a lot of crimes that

8:40 ↗ they've been able to uh either catch the

8:43 ↗ people in the act for example if we had

8:45 ↗ someone or one of our cameras on the

8:46 ↗ Ingress egress on South Front Street as

8:50 ↗ they're coming in off Hobart by the time

8:52 ↗ we all know with traffic especially

8:54 ↗ during certain hours of the day if

8:55 ↗ someone pass that camera with a stolen

8:58 ↗ car and they're coming into our city or

9:00 ↗ they took it and they're leaving our

9:01 ↗ city we would have access especially if

9:03 ↗ they were coming into our city probably

9:04 ↗ before they ever got to second half

9:06 ↗ because we would have people at the if

9:08 ↗ they were at the station or anywhere

9:09 ↗ else could get there and we could cut

9:10 ↗ them off before they even got very much

9:12 ↗ into our city because of how traffic is

9:14 ↗ now going out we would be able to let

9:16 ↗ County know and or go that direction and

9:19 ↗ then let other agencies know too to

9:21 ↗ catch those individuals if someone had

9:22 ↗ one of our own people that were our own

9:25 ↗ um neighborhoods that got their vehicle

9:27 ↗ stolen so those are nice pieces of

9:29 ↗ information to have and that's another

9:31 ↗ piece that they are utilized for next

9:33 ↗ slide

9:34 ↗ please local communities supporting or

9:37 ↗ actively utilizing the flock cameras the

9:39 ↗ HOAs currently that are in support or

9:41 ↗ currently have are the Highlands

9:43 ↗ Community High Grove Estates Association

9:46 ↗ mantro HOA and samamish Bluffs HOA

9:49 ↗ current flock cameras in a squad that

9:51 ↗ we're actually using um for the

9:53 ↗ businesses are Lowe's rally properties

9:56 ↗ and the woods and those three um have

9:58 ↗ given us access and there's one more as

10:01 ↗ well that we're working with um as far

10:03 ↗ as that fourth one next slide

10:06 ↗ please so there's different types of

10:09 ↗ flock cameras and that's why when you

10:11 ↗ saw these Pages you would see that there

10:13 ↗ were different prices and I'm going to

10:14 ↗ explain that a little bit so for this

10:17 ↗ one the Falcon the LPR it's used for the

10:20 ↗ two-lane roads so for example I already

10:22 ↗ talked about hobar Andor South Front

10:25 ↗ Street this would be the price of a

10:26 ↗ camera in that jurisdiction or area and

10:29 ↗ because because that's only a two-lane

10:30 ↗ roadway the ones that are more expensive

10:33 ↗ which is the next slide I can go into

10:34 ↗ this one but there's a reinc herring fee

10:36 ↗ of the 3,000 per contract per camera

10:38 ↗ year um or damage to the camera or theft

10:41 ↗ and there's the cost for the total of

10:43 ↗ 800 per camera on that next slide please

10:47 ↗ this one is for the long range camera

10:48 ↗ which is more for the for Lane roads

10:50 ↗ like sr900 would be one that we might

10:53 ↗ use that for and so this is a location

10:56 ↗ that they would be and it's more

10:57 ↗ expensive because it's a wider range um

11:01 ↗ covers longer distance and so this

11:03 ↗ includes permits installation traffic

11:05 ↗ plans regular out maintenance of the

11:07 ↗ camera system reoccurring of 5,000

11:10 ↗ versus the three damage to the camera

11:12 ↗ theft um is the same $800 for the camera

11:15 ↗ itself next slide

11:18 ↗ please so local isqua examples recently

11:21 ↗ ipd Patrol was dispatched to a theft

11:23 ↗ from a vehicle a witness provided a

11:25 ↗ license plate from out of state but did

11:26 ↗ not know which state and a vehicle

11:29 ↗ called

11:30 ↗ using flock another officer was able to

11:32 ↗ find the state the license plate was out

11:34 ↗ of and obtain the image of the vehicle

11:36 ↗ from another City's flock camera which

11:38 ↗ allowed the officer to investigate

11:40 ↗ further next slide please so some other

11:44 ↗ possible examples of uses of this is

11:46 ↗ when we have Amber and silver alerts so

11:48 ↗ if we have Amber and silver alerts that

11:50 ↗ go out Statewide if they happen to come

11:52 ↗ into our city for any reason or if we

11:54 ↗ ourselves um hopefully not but if we

11:57 ↗ happen to have one and we push that out

11:59 ↗ out when we could find when and where

12:01 ↗ they left and what direction they were

12:03 ↗ traveling which is more data to give any

12:04 ↗ other agencies as well and track that

12:07 ↗ down another is a detective uh

12:09 ↗ detectives investigating recent

12:11 ↗ residential burglary we had no leads the

12:13 ↗ vehicle description was vague flock

12:15 ↗ cameras would have allowed them to

12:17 ↗ locate the vehicle license plate and

12:18 ↗ pursue the case more efficiently press

12:21 ↗ providing closer to the victim quicker

12:23 ↗ the other part to that is for example we

12:25 ↗ just had a robbery at Target moments

12:28 ↗ before I came over here with some

12:30 ↗ juveniles and the persons at the

12:32 ↗ hospital we would be able to track some

12:34 ↗ of those at different locations we did

12:36 ↗ some in we got some information U before

12:39 ↗ I came over here as well and that I

12:42 ↗ don't believe are in our slides but they

12:44 ↗ did a map and I'm going to send over

12:45 ↗ that email because I got that

12:47 ↗ information today so it was after these

12:49 ↗ slides but they did a overview and this

12:52 ↗ is what flock system does in the event

12:54 ↗ that this is something that you guys

12:56 ↗ approved or the council approved to go

12:58 ↗ or to go to council

12:59 ↗ the committee I it would be that flock

13:02 ↗ would come in and they can answer so

13:04 ↗ many different questions they have a

13:05 ↗ representative that has gone to numerous

13:07 ↗ councils and one of the things that they

13:09 ↗ do is a map of what they would how many

13:12 ↗ cameras it would take to get every

13:14 ↗ Ingress and egress in our city and I can

13:16 ↗ send you that link because they have it

13:18 ↗ all mapped out and they could show you

13:19 ↗ exactly everywhere and what they're

13:21 ↗ total this and again I'm not

13:23 ↗ recommending this part of it I think

13:25 ↗ there it's it's beneficial to have all

13:27 ↗ the information and scale down versus is

13:29 ↗ the other way around and not know what

13:30 ↗ that would look like so if we wanted

13:33 ↗ every Ingress and egress in and out of

13:34 ↗ our city would be 19 cameras if we

13:37 ↗ wanted every single major intersection

13:40 ↗ which would be 23 more cameras above

13:41 ↗ that again I'm not recommending

13:44 ↗ necessarily we get that many cameras um

13:46 ↗ number one the cost is very expensive uh

13:48 ↗ but number two that I don't know that we

13:51 ↗ have as much trouble in every single one

13:52 ↗ of those areas in and out of our city or

13:55 ↗ at those intersections I can tell you

13:58 ↗ that a lot of intersection

13:59 ↗ and major situ locations in many cities

14:02 ↗ have hugely benefited and Major Crimes

14:04 ↗ have been solved by having some of these

14:07 ↗ uh there also has been you might find

14:09 ↗ when you look up flock camera I believe

14:10 ↗ it's in Virginia but there was a lawsuit

14:12 ↗ that was filed because there was some

14:14 ↗ worry and concern about the fact that if

14:16 ↗ you have too many cameras what you're

14:18 ↗ doing is trying to be big brother and

14:19 ↗ track like where's someone going and

14:21 ↗ where they're going to and from that's

14:23 ↗ not the intent of the cameras where our

14:25 ↗ intent is to find and deter crime um

14:28 ↗ they put up big signs saying flock

14:29 ↗ cameras based on that camera and in and

14:32 ↗ out of the Cities so people have

14:33 ↗ knowledge and information we would put

14:35 ↗ it up on social media and let all the

14:36 ↗ citizens in neighborhoods know that

14:38 ↗ that's what was happening and that's

14:40 ↗ where they would even where they would

14:42 ↗ be placed it wouldn't be that they were

14:43 ↗ secret or we were trying to hide

14:45 ↗ anything and then we will have all the

14:46 ↗ audits as well which anybody or

14:48 ↗ specifically the Committees Andor

14:50 ↗ council could ask for an audit at any

14:52 ↗ point in time say hey I'd like to know

14:54 ↗ can you print that up or show me give me

14:56 ↗ the link so I can look it up and bring

14:58 ↗ those information as a report throughout

15:00 ↗ the year on how many times we've even

15:02 ↗ we've even utilized them and then if

15:04 ↗ we've got any leads or any crimes have

15:06 ↗ been committed um or caught and closed

15:09 ↗ because of the cameras as well because

15:11 ↗ then you could do it on a yearby year

15:12 ↗ basis to know if they've been beneficial

15:14 ↗ and helpful and how many crimes they

15:16 ↗ were part

15:17 ↗ of can you go next slide please so again

15:20 ↗ the directions needed and I'm happy to

15:22 ↗ answer any questions but we're asking

15:24 ↗ the administration is asking the service

15:25 ↗ of safety and Parks count or Council

15:27 ↗ committee for input on the discussion of

15:30 ↗ purchasing flock cameras as a supplement

15:32 ↗ to Aid law enforcement in keeping

15:34 ↗ citizens

15:37 ↗ safe so I'll start off with uh with a

15:41 ↗ question couple of questions um I'm not

15:44 ↗ I didn't see in your

15:47 ↗ presentation uh a scale but we were I

15:49 ↗ think you said six cameras was how we do

15:52 ↗ we do we have

15:53 ↗ a are you do you have a specific number

15:57 ↗ of cameras in mind for a project or are

16:00 ↗ we just talking about generally speaking

16:02 ↗ are we willing to entertain the concept

16:04 ↗ of flock cameras or is there a package

16:06 ↗ size year I would say giving you all the

16:09 ↗ information about to do all the Ingress

16:11 ↗ and egress we already currently have 10

16:13 ↗ that are privately owned and it was just

16:16 ↗ giving you the I guess putting out the

16:18 ↗ idea for to see what the citizens and

16:21 ↗ the council are interested in um not

16:25 ↗ necessarily a recommendation for those

16:27 ↗ specifically because I think that's it's

16:30 ↗ I can make a recommendation but I think

16:32 ↗ that would be a little bit later time if

16:35 ↗ the council is something that they

16:36 ↗ wanted to pursue got it I know that uh

16:40 ↗ well next question would be in your

16:43 ↗ example that you gave um it involved

16:47 ↗ interdepartmental uh cooperation the

16:50 ↗ example that you gave it sounded like um

16:53 ↗ we went we saw the flock from another

16:55 ↗ the flock data from another municipality

16:57 ↗ is that is that what you said in in the

17:00 ↗ example that we gave here the one with

17:01 ↗ the out ofate

17:03 ↗ plate no that's what what that just

17:05 ↗ means is we were able to run it in our

17:06 ↗ state computer because we could run it

17:08 ↗ down and we narrowed down to what the

17:10 ↗ colors were because um and the place

17:12 ↗ Itself by the numbers so we run it when

17:15 ↗ we run a plate it doesn't have to be

17:17 ↗ just in Washington when we run a plate

17:19 ↗ we don't have to attach a state we can

17:20 ↗ if we actually know the state which

17:22 ↗ makes it a lot faster but if we don't we

17:24 ↗ can run it and put a generic like in a

17:26 ↗ region or we can do it United States

17:28 ↗ wide

17:29 ↗ and then we might get multiple returns

17:31 ↗ but having that information in and of

17:33 ↗ itself without knowing the state we were

17:35 ↗ able to run that and because of the

17:37 ↗ flock camera without even reading the

17:39 ↗ state and still be able to get a return

17:41 ↗ got it okay I miss I misunderstood

17:44 ↗ this pardon

17:46 ↗ me

17:48 ↗ questions um I just thought of one while

17:51 ↗ you were asking and that is you know you

17:53 ↗ talked about putting the signs up um how

17:56 ↗ do we communicate to the bad guys in the

17:58 ↗ back gals that they're also being

18:01 ↗ photographed is is that how somebody

18:03 ↗ would know oh I don't want to go to

18:05 ↗ isqua because they've got flocked

18:08 ↗ cameras that they could know that

18:09 ↗ because if we put we can even put the

18:11 ↗ signs on all the Ingress egresses that

18:13 ↗ we could get 19 signs going in and out

18:15 ↗ of the city um but we wouldn't they

18:18 ↗ would all know the whole point is for

18:20 ↗ everybody to know hopefully they

18:21 ↗ wouldn't want to come here and do that

18:22 ↗ anyway but it's pretty well known that

18:24 ↗ almost all the cities and even like

18:26 ↗ Lowe's has them a lot of the different a

18:29 ↗ lot of the lights with the cameras now

18:30 ↗ you're seeing some of those now are the

18:32 ↗ flock cameras and so they know that law

18:34 ↗ enforcement has access they know that

18:36 ↗ these people have access so they're

18:38 ↗ still committing crimes anyway this is

18:40 ↗ just a way for us to catch them a little

18:42 ↗ bit faster or catch them at all whereas

18:44 ↗ in the past maybe we didn't have that

18:46 ↗ option so they deter to go to different

18:48 ↗ cities that don't have as many or don't

18:49 ↗ have them at all so that's one of the

18:52 ↗ pieces that we're also considering in

18:54 ↗ that factor is trying to deter that

18:56 ↗ crime Andor have the access to the

18:58 ↗ information

18:59 ↗ sooner or like some of the other

19:01 ↗ agencies because if they come here and

19:03 ↗ they're in someone else's car it'll

19:05 ↗ trigger immediately on a stolen car so

19:08 ↗ that's a nice piece the minute someone

19:10 ↗ reports their car's stolen we get it

19:12 ↗ entered into the computer system they

19:14 ↗ literally could go from hypothetically

19:16 ↗ up in the highlands drive around town

19:19 ↗ because they stole someone's wallet or

19:20 ↗ somebody or their car and decided to go

19:22 ↗ to a gas station and if they pause for

19:25 ↗ you know a moment's time by the time our

19:26 ↗ officer gets there and confirms a plate

19:28 ↗ or whatever it's in the system before

19:29 ↗ maybe they leave the city well then we

19:32 ↗ can track that this was then when they

19:33 ↗ were last in our city or they haven't

19:34 ↗ left the city yet so that means we can

19:37 ↗ continue to search in our city or we

19:38 ↗ know they've left so we let neighboring

19:40 ↗ agencies know hey this car was just

19:42 ↗ stolen it's headed your way we can also

19:45 ↗ give that information and it gives again

19:47 ↗ faster opportunity to help those victims

19:49 ↗ get their property

19:52 ↗ back have we done an estimate of and and

19:56 ↗ again I you're not asking specific

19:58 ↗ number of cameras but let's just throw a

20:01 ↗ uh a notion out there you said there

20:03 ↗ were 19 if we wanted all the Ingress and

20:05 ↗ egress to the city do we understand what

20:07 ↗ the Staffing impact would be to uh to

20:10 ↗ manage the data stream of those 19

20:12 ↗ cameras so the one thing about these

20:15 ↗ cameras is we don't manage anything we

20:17 ↗ can't look at them we can't have someone

20:18 ↗ monitoring them it's not like people are

20:20 ↗ getting tickets every day hugely

20:23 ↗ different than like for example the

20:24 ↗ speed camera over by the school not the

20:27 ↗ same any way shape or form that one

20:29 ↗ every time there's a ticket which could

20:30 ↗ be hundreds a day someone has to monitor

20:32 ↗ and go through all those we only get the

20:35 ↗ cameras are going and look on the

20:37 ↗ cameras that's what that audits was

20:38 ↗ about if we have someone say for example

20:41 ↗ let's say South COA have a South Cove

20:44 ↗ has a camera and we go out there because

20:47 ↗ somebody's car was stolen or there was a

20:49 ↗ vehicle proud at three of the houses and

20:51 ↗ they tell us it was at certain time a

20:53 ↗ day we have to have a case number to be

20:54 ↗ able to go in there and attach that to

20:57 ↗ why we would look at that camera if we

20:59 ↗ don't we can't be looking at those

21:00 ↗ cameras we're not allowed we don't have

21:02 ↗ access to go in there it timestamps who

21:04 ↗ logged in what time they logged in what

21:06 ↗ it was for and if it's not attached to a

21:09 ↗ case number that actually was a legit

21:11 ↗ case or case number then we can't we

21:13 ↗ don't have access so it isn't like we're

21:15 ↗ monitoring or Staffing that on a regular

21:17 ↗ basis it's just for our detectives it's

21:19 ↗ another tool in our toolbx to go have

21:22 ↗ access to if there is a crime that's

21:24 ↗ been committed or we get reported to

21:26 ↗ us um so maybe I'm maybe I'm not

21:30 ↗ understanding it I guess I assumed that

21:33 ↗ if a if a stolen vehicle entered the

21:36 ↗ city and it registered the license plate

21:39 ↗ of a vehicle that had been stolen it

21:40 ↗ would send an alert to you guys saying

21:43 ↗ hey I've just detected a stolen vehicle

21:46 ↗ correct so you would anticipate I mean

21:48 ↗ I'm looking at this book at this yaka U

21:52 ↗ page from December and it says assisted

21:53 ↗ in 29 arrests 785 wanted persons 681

21:59 ↗ warrants 58 stolen vehicles 33 stolen

22:02 ↗ plates eight violent persons six

22:04 ↗ protection orders I mean that represents

22:06 ↗ work for you guys right sure so do we

22:09 ↗ understand if we were to put 19 cameras

22:11 ↗ in my my concern is just and I'm I you

22:16 ↗ know this better than I do we have a

22:17 ↗ small police force and just to make sure

22:20 ↗ that this wouldn't create an undue

22:22 ↗ imposition by the am by the amount of

22:24 ↗ hits that would be coming in do we

22:26 ↗ understand what the expected hit rate

22:28 ↗ that we might see on 19 cameras and are

22:31 ↗ we ready for that with with our staffing

22:34 ↗ I would say 19 cameras um no we are not

22:37 ↗ ready for that I'm not going to give

22:39 ↗ false information um 19 cameras no I

22:42 ↗ don't think we're staff for that because

22:43 ↗ God forbid that we have 19 stolen cars

22:46 ↗ even at one time that come in through

22:48 ↗ those and so it would take a priority

22:51 ↗ and we would prioritize and that's what

22:53 ↗ it would look like so had we had 19

22:54 ↗ cameras it would be and they were all

22:56 ↗ implemented it would be a prioritization

22:59 ↗ no different than some of these other

23:00 ↗ agencies that you're seeing that are

23:02 ↗ smaller but have certain numbers of

23:04 ↗ cameras they don't have the officers to

23:06 ↗ do 23 you know Bell viw and different

23:08 ↗ ones Bell viw is in the process of

23:10 ↗ adding flat cameras as well they're not

23:11 ↗ on there because that's not finalized

23:13 ↗ yet but say Redmond for example for the

23:15 ↗ number of cameras they have if all those

23:16 ↗ hit at the same time they don't have the

23:18 ↗ Staffing for that either the hope is

23:20 ↗ that number one it's a deterrent and

23:22 ↗ then number two in the event that we

23:24 ↗ have them or a stolen car goes into one

23:26 ↗ of those communities yes it triggers a

23:27 ↗ camera or an alert to all the officers

23:30 ↗ and the Dispatch Center to let them know

23:32 ↗ that that happened now it's also a

23:34 ↗ property crime so if we have personal

23:36 ↗ crimes that are going on at the time

23:38 ↗ they would be prioritized after the fact

23:40 ↗ so in other words that stolen card would

23:42 ↗ take secondary to the victim and prop

23:45 ↗ personal crimes that are happening in

23:46 ↗ the city so that would be how it would

23:49 ↗ be prioritized and yes we would have

23:51 ↗ those were things that would have to be

23:52 ↗ done in those circumstances if we had

23:54 ↗ that many

23:55 ↗ cameras thank you that's a good

23:58 ↗ explanation I appreciate

24:00 ↗ it Deputy council president um so you

24:04 ↗ kind of alluded to that lawsuit in

24:05 ↗ Virginia and um so I'm sorry to have to

24:09 ↗ ask you this but um these cameras would

24:12 ↗ not be used to track for example

24:15 ↗ undocumented workers um and those kinds

24:17 ↗ of things I'm presuming in other words

24:20 ↗ we're going to Define crime as a crime

24:23 ↗ against property or a crime against

24:24 ↗ persons but not a crime against

24:26 ↗ immigration law right correct 100%

24:30 ↗ okay thank

24:32 ↗ you do we have any more questions before

24:36 ↗ we because um then we would uh check

24:39 ↗ again to see if we had any members of

24:40 ↗ the public online with us and then we

24:42 ↗ would go into deliberations let's do

24:44 ↗ that okay uh that's what we will do and

24:47 ↗ Chris I will ask you again whether any

24:48 ↗ members of the public are with us online

24:51 ↗ we have no members of the public in

24:53 ↗ attendance well then I will not give my

24:55 ↗ big public comment spiel can I make one

24:59 ↗ more of course brief comment um to your

25:02 ↗ question uh Deputy Council Barbara de

25:05 ↗ Michelle uh we are not going to be

25:07 ↗ tracking anybody that's not our goal is

25:09 ↗ to track anybody so not just

25:11 ↗ undocumented but we're not tracking

25:13 ↗ anybody by these it's to give us

25:15 ↗ information on where people entered and

25:18 ↗ um left our city last uh that have been

25:21 ↗ either committed a crime or that we were

25:24 ↗ um pursuing in uh an investigation but

25:28 ↗ not track and they're not to be tracking

25:30 ↗ it's for us to see if we can locate so

25:33 ↗ that's the difference in tracking in

25:35 ↗ locating are two different things um so

25:38 ↗ example if you got up in the morning we

25:39 ↗ wouldn't want to track you and find you

25:41 ↗ if you're making it and going oh she's

25:43 ↗ late for the meeting can we track her

25:45 ↗ and see where she's going they're

25:46 ↗ they're not for intended for any purpose

25:48 ↗ like

25:51 ↗ that all right well we don't have to we

25:54 ↗ have no members of the public with us uh

25:56 ↗ I will say that we did receive reive uh

26:00 ↗ a small amount of uh feedback from the

26:02 ↗ public I would say that uh the light

26:05 ↗ feedback thus far has been positive I

26:08 ↗ haven't I have not seen any feedback

26:10 ↗ from the public that would have a

26:12 ↗ negative concern about this General

26:13 ↗ support for as as this being a

26:18 ↗ uh fair and Equitable addition to public

26:22 ↗ safety tools um should should we go

26:26 ↗ forward so

26:29 ↗ pardon

26:30 ↗ me so what do you think for uh

26:34 ↗ recommendation back to the

26:35 ↗ administration and to our fellow council

26:36 ↗ members so yeah I'm I'm generally very

26:39 ↗ positive about this and I did a mini

26:41 ↗ survey of about three people and they

26:44 ↗ were all they all gave me positive

26:45 ↗ feedback and said they thought it

26:47 ↗ sounded like a good idea so um but uh

26:51 ↗ and you know you heard this when we were

26:53 ↗ doing body cameras uh Chief Schwan

26:55 ↗ always concerned about the privacy of

26:58 ↗ our citizens and um and also I think

27:02 ↗ we're in a very um sensitive political

27:05 ↗ environment right now where there are

27:08 ↗ groups of people in our community who

27:10 ↗ are very very concerned about

27:11 ↗ surveillance and um people watching them

27:15 ↗ and so forth so my thought is let let's

27:18 ↗ go forward um and I I really appreciate

27:21 ↗ you coming to us with the idea of having

27:24 ↗ a conversation about this and a

27:26 ↗ discussion um before we get to the point

27:29 ↗ where we actually have a proposal on the

27:30 ↗ table and I'm just uh thinking that um

27:34 ↗ perhaps we can you you already talked to

27:37 ↗ HOAs and other groups about this but I'm

27:40 ↗ wondering if we could do a little bit of

27:41 ↗ more Outreach in some of the communities

27:43 ↗ that right now are feeling very fearful

27:45 ↗ about what's going on so uh for example

27:48 ↗ reaching out to the circle to talk to

27:50 ↗ the Hispanic community and so forth um

27:53 ↗ and just with information about what

27:56 ↗ this is and what this isn't I really

27:58 ↗ liked your slide that was what this

28:01 ↗ isn't um and explaining to people before

28:04 ↗ we get to the point of putting those

28:05 ↗ signs up um right now uh we have a

28:10 ↗ situation we're going to talk about

28:11 ↗ Communications at the council Retreat we

28:14 ↗ have uh a situation where uh rumors and

28:18 ↗ conspiracy theories and all kinds of

28:20 ↗ false information gets going in the

28:22 ↗ community before ahead of us and I'm

28:25 ↗ thinking let's get ahead of that and be

28:28 ↗ be a little bit more proactive and talk

28:30 ↗ to different communities that might be

28:32 ↗ fearful or where conspiracy theories

28:34 ↗ might take hold ahead of time to explain

28:37 ↗ what we're doing um and then so that

28:40 ↗ when uh people uh when these cameras go

28:42 ↗ in um people uh are armed with some

28:47 ↗ information ahead of time rather than us

28:50 ↗ being reactive after after the the fact

28:54 ↗ um but you know I also recognize that

28:57 ↗ some of our minority communities are

28:59 ↗ often the victims of crimes and would

29:02 ↗ very much welcome uh another level of

29:05 ↗ security for this community and so uh as

29:08 ↗ I said I generally I think this is a

29:11 ↗ good proposal and uh I think that it

29:14 ↗ would be uh something that we could use

29:16 ↗ that would be effective tool for law

29:18 ↗ enforcement so I say let's go ahead but

29:21 ↗ let's just think about how we

29:23 ↗ communicate this in this particular time

29:26 ↗ frame in this particular time of History

29:28 ↗ it might be really good for us to try to

29:30 ↗ get ahead of um of the um of the rumors

29:34 ↗ and the conspiracy theories uh instead

29:36 ↗ of be reactive to it does that make

29:39 ↗ sense to you yes ma'am oh

29:42 ↗ okay what's the old quote rumors make it

29:45 ↗ all the way around the world before

29:46 ↗ truth gets it gets their pants on or

29:48 ↗ something there's some some quote like

29:50 ↗ that yeah and I think I think maybe a

29:53 ↗ year ago we wouldn't have had this

29:55 ↗ concern uh but right now it it we're

29:58 ↗ just in a very volatile position uh in

30:02 ↗ environment I think everywhere in our

30:04 ↗ country right now and so I think we just

30:06 ↗ need to be very sensitive and and

30:09 ↗ considera of that thank you so for any

30:13 ↗ new uh Public Safety technology I asked

30:15 ↗ myself four questions when trying to

30:18 ↗ assess the value of it does it make the

30:20 ↗ public safer safer does it make our

30:22 ↗ officers safer does it make our officers

30:25 ↗ more effective and does it prevent or or

30:27 ↗ deter crime um I uh it definitely uh

30:33 ↗ seems like uh it would make officers

30:37 ↗ more effective and prevent or deter

30:39 ↗ crime um so you know the the net

30:43 ↗ positive of this seems obvious to me um

30:46 ↗ the cost uh seems Seems compared to so

30:50 ↗ many of the systems that uh are open to

30:52 ↗ municipalities this

30:54 ↗ seems uh ref ref refle

30:58 ↗ refreshingly uh reasonably priced

31:01 ↗ compared to although you know quantities

31:04 ↗ uh add up and everything but uh uh this

31:07 ↗ doesn't seem like uh shockingly

31:09 ↗ expensive the way say radios are

31:11 ↗ shockingly expensive as systems um so

31:14 ↗ I'm very positive I think that you've

31:16 ↗ pointed out you you've preemptively

31:18 ↗ addressed um some of the concerns that

31:20 ↗ people might have I think that um by

31:24 ↗ being uh by focusing on license plates

31:26 ↗ by not taking biometric data or data

31:29 ↗ about individuals I think that um I'm I

31:33 ↗ I feel like I can already have a

31:34 ↗ conversation with the public uh and that

31:37 ↗ if folks are concerned uh we do live in

31:39 ↗ an era where where people on both ends

31:42 ↗ of the spectrum have lots of opinions

31:44 ↗ about uh their privacy in public and and

31:47 ↗ whatnot but this seems to me uh to be uh

31:51 ↗ A system that uh uh it would be easy to

31:55 ↗ talk to the public about uh any concerns

31:57 ↗ they might have in that way although I I

32:00 ↗ share council member D Michelle's idea

32:02 ↗ that um we would definitely want to get

32:04 ↗ ahead of this and make sure that you

32:06 ↗ know it's far better to uh prevent

32:09 ↗ rumors from starting than trying to

32:10 ↗ stamp them out once they once they've

32:12 ↗ already started

32:14 ↗ so so I'm positive as well um City

32:18 ↗ administrator do you have what you were

32:20 ↗ looking for from us this evening is

32:21 ↗ there other information we could provide

32:23 ↗ for you uh thank you Mr chair uh Deputy

32:26 ↗ council president uh I believe what I'm

32:28 ↗ hearing from the committee is you are

32:30 ↗ all right with us moving forward um as

32:33 ↗ the chief has said we don't have a

32:34 ↗ specific plan in place so our next step

32:36 ↗ would be to put one together uh there

32:38 ↗ will be a financial impact to that uh we

32:41 ↗ will have to assess if that's something

32:42 ↗ we can absorb within current budgets or

32:45 ↗ if we'll need additional resources so

32:48 ↗ we'll come back to you with that um so

32:50 ↗ notification is sufficient once we make

32:53 ↗ a determination would you want us to

32:54 ↗ bring this back to the council the

32:56 ↗ dollar amounts could very well be within

32:59 ↗ the mayor's purchasing Authority so it

33:01 ↗ would not automatically come back before

33:03 ↗ the council so how would you like us

33:05 ↗ once we have a plan in place to let you

33:08 ↗ know and let the larger Community know I

33:10 ↗ mean that's a good question I think one

33:12 ↗ of the things that is informat

33:15 ↗ surprising and informative is the fact

33:16 ↗ that there flock cameras already out

33:18 ↗ there in the community and this hasn't

33:20 ↗ this isn't an issue that's been uh

33:22 ↗ become a problem and and that's even

33:26 ↗ flock cameras in private hand

33:28 ↗ right uh that don't have this

33:30 ↗ necessarily the same uh uh transparency

33:34 ↗ or or you know data auditing uh that we

33:37 ↗ would require um council member D

33:39 ↗ Michelle and as part of our our Council

33:41 ↗ leadership team how do you how do you

33:42 ↗ feel about this question about how this

33:44 ↗ comes

33:45 ↗ back uh

33:47 ↗ wow I you know I think I'm fine with it

33:50 ↗ just being a

33:52 ↗ notification um we have a good case

33:54 ↗ that's been put forward for doing this

33:57 ↗ and

33:58 ↗ um I feel like I could explain why we

34:00 ↗ were moving ahead so um let's let's do

34:04 ↗ it that way if it's yeah let's do it

34:06 ↗ that way and I'll be ready to if it

34:08 ↗ comes back on consent I'll be ready to

34:10 ↗ discuss it in my report if if somebody

34:13 ↗ on the council wants

34:14 ↗ me and our plan would not be to take it

34:17 ↗ to the full Council oh and even on

34:19 ↗ consent just that okay if you would like

34:22 ↗ us to we we could guess the

34:25 ↗ question yes I'm F I'm fine with that

34:29 ↗ okay so we would just notify via email

34:31 ↗ that's fine very good all right thank

34:33 ↗ you appreciate and thanks Chief thank

34:35 ↗ you so much for this presentation this

34:36 ↗ evening I think it was very very

34:38 ↗ effective particularly uh the Aima uh

34:42 ↗ reference information uh really helpful

34:44 ↗ to see how another city has implemented

34:46 ↗ I note that they've seen a reduction in

34:48 ↗ stolen cars over the last few years I

34:50 ↗ would also like to see a reduction in

34:52 ↗ the number of stolen cars thank you for

34:54 ↗ having me also I will forward you over

34:56 ↗ that email as well I'll forward it to um

34:59 ↗ Mr gski about the clerk to forward to

35:03 ↗ you guys regarding the mapping that they

35:06 ↗ have for the intersections and or all

35:08 ↗ the Ingress egress for our city so then

35:11 ↗ you would have a little bit more data

35:12 ↗ also on and to um City administrator so

35:17 ↗ that way everybody has access of

35:19 ↗ information and can see where they may

35:20 ↗ want those as well as I'll put some data

35:23 ↗ with that on where we've seen the

35:24 ↗ majority or most traffic happening to

35:27 ↗ where it may be that would be most

35:29 ↗ beneficial for the

35:31 ↗ recommendation great thank you so much

35:34 ↗ Chief uh and City administrator uh since

35:38 ↗ you've indicated you have everything you

35:39 ↗ need from us we're going to consider

35:41 ↗ this agenda item done uh Deputy council

35:44 ↗ president do you have any announcements

35:46 ↗ I do not I do not as well so therefore

35:48 ↗ we are adjoin adjourned adjoined joined

35:52 ↗ adjourned at uh 7:07 p.m thank you for

35:55 ↗ those watching at home

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